[Rhodes22-list] cockpit bench seat reinforcement

Tue Aug 24 13:54:38 EDT 2004

Wearing my gofer hat and have to run but can't resist answering this one:

The Rhodes people have gone to great expense to bring you a separate cockpit
liner so the seats are open underneath unlike all competitive boats that
make their decks in one piece providing a continuous hard seat.  The Rhodes
seats have a natural built in spring and will not break unless you have one
built by an early contractor in which case I do not know what they did.

The creaky noise you hear is built in to give you the feel of an authentic
old wooden boat.  If you do not buy that explanation the creaky noise is
akin to crickets rubbing their legs.  The cut outs in the ends of the
cockpit liner may be making contact with the seat as it extends past this
vertical glass member and when you step on the seat, its flexibility is
making it rub the vertical ends of the cockpit liner creating a non
invasive, scary to some sound.  You can eliminate this by increasing the
spacing between the seat stiffeners and the vertical end walls of the
cockpit liner so when the seats flex for your comfort they still do not make
contact with the cockpit liner glass walls.

stan/gbi

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bill Effros" <bill at effros.com>
To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 11:47 AM
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] cockpit bench seat reinforcement

Has anyone ever had the cockpit seats break?  This question comes up again
and again, but Stan never changes the design of the boat.  I like to keep
cockpit cushions on the seats which also distributes the weight of people
standing on them.  While I'm sure Roger's solution is bulletproof, my
question is whether Stan's original solution is also bulletproof.

Bill Effros

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Bob Weber
To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 11:29 AM
Subject: RE: [Rhodes22-list] cockpit bench seat reinforcement

Lou, I had the same question last year. The best solution is below.

Bob Weber

Thanks  Roger for the fix.
I have the same issue with the seats on  my 1974/75 Rhodes 22.
I will use your fix.

Bob
S/V Knot Necessary

>>>cen09402 at centurytel.net 04/09/03 09:47AM >>>
Bob,

When I first got my 1976 R-22, I didn't care for the way the cockpit seats
"creaked" when walked or sat upon.  So, I reinforced my cockpit seats with
1" OD stainless steel tubing from below.  I have two support columns per
side for a total of four in all.  These support columns were mostly
assembled from off-the-shelf stainless steel railing hardware.  The enclosed
link will show you a picture of one of these support columns:

http://www.rhodes22.org/rhodes/pics/Propane-1.jpg

The only custom made components were the oddly shaped spacers between the
top of the support columns and the underside of the cockpit seats.  One of
these spacers is visible in the above photo.  These pieces were designed to
take the irregularity out of the upper bearing surfaces on the underside of
the cockpit seats & provide nice flat areas for the support columns to rest
upon.  At the time, I happened to have several scrap pieces of black, UV
stabilized, UHMWPE polymer, which I used for these spacers.  However, these
spacers are out of the weather and are not in direct sunlight.  So, there is
no reason why they couldn't be fabricated out of wood.  If you make them
from wood; then, I would either paint them or seal them with epoxy.  Please
note that all four support columns will be slightly different & will have to
be custom cut to length for that specific position.  Likewise, the spacers
will have to be custom made for each position.

One critical construction detail not visible in the photo is the use of 1"
OD stainless steel fender washers inside the stanchion mounts, top and
bottom.  These fender washers spread the compression loads on the top spacer
and the cockpit sole such that the ends of the 1" OD tubing do not gouge
into either when heavily loaded.  Thus, the 1" OD stainless steel tubing
must be cut to a precise length = (the vertical distance between the cockpit
sole and the top spacer) - (the thickness of two fender washers) in that
specific position.  Although there are setscrews in the stanchion mounts,
they are not involved in supporting the compression loads.  The stanchion
mounts merely locate the ends of the support columns top & bottom and
prevent lateral movement.

This fix has been absolutely bulletproof since 1987, including several hard
falls against the cockpit seats by big people.

Good luck!

Roger Pihlaja
S/V Dynamic Equilibrium

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Weber" <ruba1811 at hotmail.com>
To: <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2003 5:54 PM
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Reinforce Cockpit seats

>Hi all, I had one of the boards securing the underside of the cockpit
seats
>deteriorate and break on me this year.  Everyone is familiar with the
boards
>running along the front edge of the cockpit seats (the ones that hold the
>filler boards)  There is marine ply wood strips that secure the other side
>of the seat.  I will be replacing these this weekend.  It seems to be a
>staight forward job but if anyone has done this before and encountered
>problems or has a better solution,  please chime in.  The seats were
making
>a peculiar sound when stepped on prior to noticing the broken board.
Thanks
>in advance.
>
>Bob Weber
>

>From: Lou Rosenberg <lsr3 at MAIL.nyu.edu>
>Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
>Subject: [Rhodes22-list] cockpit bench seat reinforcement
>Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 11:07:03 -0400
>
>RHODIES;
>  Seeking advice on reinforcing the cockpit seats in my R22 ( 1981) . The
>boat is now secure on is trailer in its winter home in Bklyn thanks to Rick
>Centalaonza, a boat hauler ( Coastal)
>  and some good boat yard folks in Pt Jeff and Bklyn.
>  My stb side cracks when I walk or sit  on it, but is not broken. The
>glass work underneath is brittle and the wood stiffeners are missing .
>  I have Casey's book on HULL & DECK repair and plan to stiffen and support
>the entire length of both benches by epoxing a dowel in the groove and then
>adding a triangular support made of pine ( since its not going to be seen
>much , teak is overkill, I believe).  The triangular support would need to
>be epoxied to the floor underneath the seats. I plan to space the  2
>supports on each side  equally.
>
>  Has anyone had weakening of their bench seating due to damage or
>weathering and age of the glass?
>  I am wondering how the epoxied supports would react to the flexing of the
>boat later on as she is under strain.  Would it make sense to not epoxy the
>supports and just wedge them down with rubber mat under the wood?
>  **
>  Any advice appreciated !
>  thanks
>  Lou
>__________________________________________________
>Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list

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