[Rhodes22-list] New Genny - Was Bullshit

[stan]

come on guys - you are all so nice and so bright - the problem is me.  you
are comparing apples and oranges because this is not a one design boat and
every time I get an idea, dumb or otherwise, the boat changes so no one is
sailing exactly the same boat and over the years the cumulative changes
probably have resulted in changing sailing characteristics.  i.e.., sailboat
design is compromise:  the heavier boats we now build give a much more
comfortable ride and stiffer performance but sit lower in the water with
more wetted surface and therefore, while less tender, are slower than
earlier boats.  Tinkering with cb shapes and sail design and weight
distribution all take its toll so you are all probably right.  I had tossed
in a thread some weeks ago hoping for constructive bickering but hardly
anyone took me up on it.  So I will resubmit:  Contrary to MM's view I had
felt moving weight forward had a lot of benefits:  more speed from longer
water line and less transom turbulence, better pointing, more balanced helm
and maybe others and looked forward to hearing what people who, unlike me,
really get to sail my have found.  Use up some of this sail sizing energy
and lets get the weight distribution issue settled, at 20 paces.

ss/gbi


----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Effros" <bill at effros.com>
To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2004 12:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] New Genny - Was Bullshit


Roger!

What's the problem here?

I have tried to be as gentle as possible in this discussion, but you have
repeatedly hurled insults, and challenged other people's experience.  We all
know that you have been having a rough time, but that is no excuse for this
behavior.

Your experience with a cruising spinnaker is irrelevant in this discussion
of 175 genoas.  I have never, ever, had to go forward to help get the clew
across the foredeck.  Rummy says that his experience has been the same as
mine.  Fred says that his experience has been the same as Rummy's.

I wrote in an earlier post, in this same thread, stating that tacking with
the 175 is a piece of cake.  Why are you challenging my experience on this?
You don't have the 175 genny.  I have gone for entire summers without
missing a single tack! If I miss 5 a year it's a lot.  20 kt wind--2 kt
wind--it doesn't matter.  It is extremely easy to single-handedly tack a 175
genny while remaining in the cockpit of a Rhodes 22.

And while I'm at it, let me point out that we were not talking about sailing
an upwind beat with a 175 genoa fully extended inside the shrouds.  We all
know you can't do that, but for some reason you felt compelled to inject
that notion, impute it to others, and then provide an equation proving that
it is physically impossible.  Wow!

But that has nothing to do with what we were talking about.  I don't use
sailing to prove I am smarter than other people.  I sail because I like the
way it feels, and I know Rummy sails for essentially the same reason.  We
sail in 20 kt winds with fully extended 175 genoas because it's a rush, and
it's insulting to have someone who doesn't have a 175 genoa hammer home the
point that what we do can't be done.

I rarely sail on rivers.  I don't race.  I'm sure Wally will be able to
figure out the best sail for his needs, and if I could lend him my 175 I
surely would because I would love to know how it fares in his circumstances.

I feel better now.

I'm sorry if I have hurt your feelings.  That is not my intention.  However,
I think you should be spending a little more time trying not to hurt the
feelings of others.

Bill






----- Original Message -----
From: Roger Pihlaja
To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2004 6:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] New Genny - Was Bullshit


Rummy,

Sorry; but, I do have a headsail that is at least as big a 175% genoa, my
cruising spinnaker.  It is attached at the head & foot just like a genoa &
sheeted just like a genoa.  When tacking this sail in light air, someone
almost always has to go to the foredeck to help get the clew across the
foredeck.  Rummy, please don't presume to tell me what I know & what I don't
know.  At least my opinions are based upon solid theory & backed up with
data not charming anecdotes.

If you are sick of this thread; then, just hit delete and stop responding to
it.  If I'm pompous because I've called you on something that is absolutely
impossible and you just can't admit you were exagerating; then, so be it.

Roger Pihlaja
S/V Dynamic Equilibrium


----- Original Message -----
From: <R22RumRunner at aol.com>
To: <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2004 5:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] New Genny - Was Bullshit


> Roger,
> Again you are speaking out of turn. Since you don't have the 175, you
don't
> have a clue as to how it comes through. All you have is an opinion. Don't
think
> that that makes it so.
> The 175 IS NOT a bear to tack with, even in light air.
> I'm sick of this thread and your pomposity.
>
> Rummy
> __________________________________________________
> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
>
>


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