[Rhodes22-list] Some Public School Programs Work Pretty Well

[brad haslett]

Slim,

I haven't read Gardner but I've got a some others on
the shelf that debunk the Binet type IQ tests as a
sole predictor of performance.  "Emotional
Intelligence" by Daniel Goleman and "The Triarchic
Mind" by Robert Sternberg to name just two. Murray's
research actually put the IQ spread much less than 10
per cent.  Since leaving the training department
several years ago I no longer keep up with the latest
education research.

One thing I do keep up with is my property tax bill. 
In this metropolitan area every government expediture
has a racial aspect to it.  If you question the black
school board on what they did with the last tax
increase you're automatically labeled a racist. 
Asking questions like "aren't you a bit top-heavy on
administration?" and "was sending 50 people to this
conference really necessary?" are hardly racist
inquiries.  Actually, our county mayor is black.  I
voted for him because a good friend of mine worked for
him at the public defenders office and said he was a
good man.  He is.  I had to cross party lines to do it
and that meant spending more time at the polls (well,
I voted for a Democrat for Governor as well) but these
things get little notice in the paper, ie,  "mostly
white suburbs elect black county mayor".

How to solve non-functioning schools is way above my
pay grade.  Holding public officials accountable is
not.  If that makes me a racist, let it be.

Brad Haslett
"CoraShen" 


--- Steve Alm <salm at mn.rr.com> wrote:

> Brad,
> 
> I admit I'm a little fuzzy on The Bell Curve.  I
> can't find my copy and it's
> been nearly ten years since we dealt with it in my
> ed admin classes at the
> Univ. of MN, but didn't it go something like this:
> 
> Years before that book was written, people noticed
> that blacks consistently
> scored about 10% lower than whites on the
> Stanford-Binet test.  That's the
> test most commonly used back then to determine what
> is called IQ.  So there
> was a huge push for about twenty years to revise the
> SB test in order to
> level the cultural/racial playing field.  After all,
> that 10% gap must
> indicate a problem with the test.  After everybody
> was finished tinkering
> with it and subjects were tested again, the results
> were the same--a 10%
> difference.  Therefore, claimed Murray and
> Herrnstein, that settles
> it--blacks are 10% dumber than whites.  And I hope
> it goes without saying
> I'm summarizing THEIR study.
> 
> This goes far beyond the PC issue.  The importance
> of the test results is
> not just how it reflects on those who are tested,
> but it's what society does
> with that information.  These results affect policy
> decision-making,
> funding, staffing and curriculum.  For example,
> people used these results to
> lobby against programs like Head Start.  If blacks
> are 10% dumber to begin
> with, why waste resources trying to get them on a
> par with whites?  Or
> whether or not to give blacks a 10% break on
> entrance exams.  Or civil
> service tests.  And that's just the tip of the
> iceberg.  Yeah, Murray was
> crucified by some.  Practically beatified by others.
>  People tend to use
> information like this to further their agendas. 
> Therein lies the danger.
> It's much, much more than a cottage industry of PC
> as you put it.
> 
> Where does this leave us today?  We must continue to
> conduct vigorous
> research on testing for intelligence.  I'm not sure
> how much the SB test is
> still used although I suspect less and less, but
> there's a whole host of new
> studies being done.  Howard Gardner on multiple
> intelligence, for example.
> We now recognize things like emotional intelligence
> and artistic or
> aesthetic  intelligence (I like that one).
> 
> Here's an interesting little tidbit:  As recently as
> the early 1900's,
> immigrants coming through Ellis Island were given
> intelligence tests.  The
> test was written in English.  Guess what they found?
>  Brits and Irish were
> found to be intelligent.  Germans, French, Italians
> were not.
> 
> > Students attempt to meet the standards that are
> set
> > for them at home.  If those standards or even a
> > functioning home is missing, performance will
> suffer.
> > It is beyond the function of the education system
> to
> > fix those problems.
> 
> Thank you for saying that--we agree.
> 
> Slim
> 
> On 10/7/04 12:02 PM, "brad haslett"
> <flybrad at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> > Todd,
> > 
> > You may recall a controversial book that was
> published
> > in 1994 titled "The Bell Curve: Intelligence and
> Class
> > Stucture in American Life" by Herrnstein and
> Murray.
> > Herrnstein had the good sense to die before
> > publication which left Charles Murray alone to
> defend
> > chapter 13.  His studies showed that
> Asian-Americans
> > tested slightly higher in IQ than other groups but
> > this alone wouldn't account for their superior
> > academic performance.  He was crucified by the PC
> > police.  
> > 
> > Students attempt to meet the standards that are
> set
> > for them at home.  If those standards or even a
> > functioning home is missing, performance will
> suffer.
> > It is beyond the function of the education system
> to
> > fix those problems.
> > 
> > Some public schools work because the communities
> where
> > they are located work.  Merging functioning
> schools
> > with non-functioning ones generally drag both
> down.
> > This is not a racist view, this is what we used to
> > call common sense before the cottage industry of
> > political correctness was developed.
> > 
> > Brad Haslett
> > "CoraShen"
> > 
> > 
> > --- Todd Tavares <sprocket80 at mail.com> wrote:
> > 
> >> 
> >>    Roger,
> >> 
> >>        We HAD something like that here in
> Maryland,
> >> called the MSPAP.  I
> >>    was initally to used to gage how well the
> schools
> >> were teaching the
> >>    pupils.  The schools had to pass and each year
> >> show an improvement or
> >>    face take-over by the state BOE.
> >> 
> >>        We unfortunately did not reap such
> positive
> >> results.  Instead, the
> >>    results were twisted and used by a certain
> >> racially based "lobbyist"
> >>    group (no names here), to show that minority
> >> children did universally
> >>    worse than their white counterparts.  The test
> >> was supposed to be
> >>    blind and the children's sex, ethnic and
> economic
> >> information was
> >>    never to be recorded...but it was.
> >> 
> >>        A committee was formed by the state Board
> of
> >> Ed to find out why
> >>    the minority children....all except a group
> named
> >> the "Asian/Pacific
> >>    Islander Group"...were scoring poorly.   The
> >> committee spent two years
> >>    and generated a 208 page report.  I studied
> the
> >> report in painstaking
> >>    detail.  The conclusion was 11 reasons grouped
> >> into three main root
> >>    causes.  Poverty, Lack of parental
> involvement,
> >> and low self esteem.
> >>    When explaining why the Asian/Pacific Islander
> >> Group children (approx
> >>    2%) scored consistently highest in all grades
> and
> >> genders, the
> >>    committee came up  with a statement..to
> >> paraphrase it...It is widely
> >>    known that Asian students are generally the
> >> smarter.
> >> 
> >>        Poverty meant that the children were under
> >> nourished, could not
> >>    buy paper and pencils, etc.  Lack of parental
> >> involvement is
> >>    self-explanatory.  Low self esteem was sort of
> a
> >> catch-all for every
> >>    other excuse.  Low self esteem came from low
> self
> >> worth in males
> >>    because of the absence of a male role model in
> >> the home setting;
> >>    and the instructional material did not reflect
> >> enough people of color
> >>    or their heritage.  That is about the only
> point
> >> I could have agreed
> 
=== message truncated ===



		
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