[Rhodes22-list] Question for Roger on Florida Relief

[Roger Pihlaja]

Bill,

You're wrong.  The American people are the most generous in the history of
the world.  4 hurricanes hitting one state in a single season hasn't
happened since something like 1883 in Texas.  If the scope of the problem in
Florida were more widely known, I'm certain the resources to mitigate the
suffering would be found.  You can't have a national debate about an issue
when it's been so under reported & yet unprecidented in scope.

Roger Pihlaja
S/V Dynamic Equilibrium

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Effros" <bill at effros.com>
To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 2004 8:37 AM
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Question for Roger on Florida Relief


> Roger,
>
> I never questioned your motives or suggested you profited from what was
clearly a generous humanitarian gesture, nor did I ever request any
accounting from you.  Ed seems to be making a career out of misquoting
people to shift the focus from the real questions people are asking.
>
> Here is what I said:
>
> "The problem is not a lack of awareness.  The problem is that everyone
wants to get more than they give--and that just won't work.  So we fight
using code words UNTIL SOMEONE LIKE YOU COMES ALONG WHO SAYS, IN THIS CASE,
HE WANTS TO GIVE MORE THAN HE GETS."
>
> The problem is not the media.  The problem is that bright people like
Michael are living in some fantasy world thinking that private insurance is
going to pay for everything, and that the only problem is that we don't have
enough unemployed people in this country to do the work and get paid for it.
>
> To quote Eldridge Cleaver:  "If you are not part of the solution, you are
part of the problem."
>
> I believe you must speak up when you can see that Michael just doesn't get
it.  Life is a resource allocation problem.  I believe you will do more good
speaking to the core issues than you will chopping down trees in Florida.
>
> I will ask my question again, and hope to get a straight answer.  This is
not a loaded question.  It does not seek a "conservative" or "liberal" view.
It has nothing to do with this election, or this administration, or any
other extraneous matter.  The problem is not "the media".  The problem is
us.
>
> Here's the question:  "What do YOU think WE should do?"
>
> Bill Effros
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Printed copies of my book "Quote Without Comment" are now available from
Amazon and all Bookstores.
>
> Ask for "Quote Without Comment" by Bill Effros--ISBN 1-5901-9587-6
>
> If they are out of stock they can get more copies within 3 days.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Roger Pihlaja
> To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 2004 6:08 AM
> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Question for Roger on Florida Relief
>
>
> Ed, Bill,
>
> Well, my church gave me $200 before I left for Florida to help pay for my
> share of gas & food.  The folks at Peace Lutheran Church & the Arcadia
> Methodist Church treated us like honored guests while we were there & I
> didn't have to buy many meals while we were working in Florida.  On
Friday,
> just before we left, I estimated how much money I needed to get home.  I
> donated the rest, $85, to Peace Lutheran Church in the name of Trinity
> Lutheran Church in Midland, MI to help them raise the $100,000 they need
for
> the new roof & other repairs to their church sanctuary.  However, we
didn't
> do any repairs to the Peace Lutheran Church facilities.  We just lived
there
> while we were working in the area.  So, this trip cost me $0, just 9 days
of
> my life.
>
> I think I pay pretty close attention to the news media.  Each of the
> hurricanes in Florida was covered pretty well during the strike & for a
day
> or two afterwards.  Then, the media moved on to other issues & Florida
> became yesterday's news.  Until I saw the call for volunters in the
> September issue of the Lutheran magazine, I had no idea how bad the
> situation still was in Florida.  The folks in Florida feel like the rest
of
> the country has forgotten about them.  I'm just saying this is a major
> failing on the part of the mainstream news media.  There is a major
> humanitarian crisis going on under their very noses in the United States
and
> the mainstream media has simply missed it.
>
> Roger Pihlaja
> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "ed kroposki" <ekroposki at charter.net>
> To: "'The Rhodes 22 mail list'" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2004 9:03 PM
> Subject: RE: [Rhodes22-list] Question for Roger on Florida Relief
>
>
> > Roger:
> >
> > Bill said, "The problem is not a lack of awareness.  The problem is that
> > everyone wants to get more than they give"
> >
> > How much were you paid for your trip to Florida?
> >
> > I know the answer, but I think you should tell Bill.
> >
> > Ed K
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
> > [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Bill Effros
> > Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2004 8:36 PM
> > To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Florida Relief
> >
> > Roger,
> >
> > I know you didn't say anything about the Guard or disaster relief.  I
> agree
> > with you that the scale of the disaster has overwhelmed private
resources.
> >
> > The national debate IS going on about where the resources should come
> from.
> > The current administration says it should not come from the government.
> > That each of us should fix our own mobile home, and hope for charities
to
> > make up the shortfall.  The current administration also downsized the
> > national guard, and tried to fight a war on the cheap.  That hasn't
worked
> > either.
> >
> > Please note, like virtually everyone on this list and in this country I
> have
> > been on both sides of all of these issues.  The issues are not simple,
and
> > the simple answers never work out in practice.
> >
> > The problem is not a lack of awareness.  The problem is that everyone
> wants
> > to get more than they give--and that just won't work.  So we fight using
> > code words until someone like you comes along who says, in this case, he
> > wants to give more than he gets.
> >
> > Fine.  I applaud that, and so do most people.  But how do we convert
that
> > impulse into a national policy?  Do you even think we should try to
> convert
> > that impulse into a national policy?
> >
> > Bill Effros
> >
> >
> > Printed copies of my book "Quote Without Comment" are now available from
> > Amazon and all Bookstores.
> >
> > Ask for "Quote Without Comment" by Bill Effros--ISBN 1-5901-9587-6
> >
> > If they are out of stock they can get more copies within 3 days.
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Roger Pihlaja
> > To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> > Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2004 7:56 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Florida Relief
> >
> >
> > Bill,
> >
> > I didn't say anything about deploying the National Guard to help with
the
> > situation in Florida, where the disaster relief resources are going to
> come
> > from, or whether or not this is an issue the federal government should
or
> > should not be involved in.  I merely made the observation that we have a
> > humanitarian crisis of rather large scale in Florida that is going
> > unreported by the mainstream press.  It's been my experience that
> resources
> > seem to suddenly become available whenever the press exposes situations
> like
> > what is happening in Florida.
> >
> > My own sense from last week's experience is that the shear scale of the
> > disaster has overwhelmed the resources available to America's churches.
> >
> > At the very least, I think there should be a national debate or at least
> an
> > awareness at the national level of just how bad things still are down
> there
> > in Florida.
> >
> > Roger Pihlaja
> > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Bill Effros" <bill at effros.com>
> > To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2004 10:27 AM
> > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Florida Relief
> >
> >
> > > Roger,
> > >
> > > We no longer have enough either money or people to deal with things
like
> > this when they come up.   The National Guard used to do what you did
last
> > week.  There was money put aside for natural disaster relief.
> > >
> > > You are going to have to decide what you think is important.  Is this
a
> > job for government, or not?
> > >
> > > When push comes to shove you can't find enough money or people to do
the
> > job privately.
> > >
> > > I don't have a scripted answer for this.  I don't think you do,
either.
> > >
> > > Bill
> > >
> > >
> > > Printed copies of my book "Quote Without Comment" are now available
from
> > Amazon and all Bookstores.
> > >
> > > Ask for "Quote Without Comment" by Bill Effros--ISBN 1-5901-9587-6
> > >
> > > If they are out of stock they can get more copies within 3 days.
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Roger Pihlaja
> > > To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> > > Sent: Monday, October 25, 2004 6:09 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak on port side bow area of the 1983
> Rhodes
> > 22
> > >
> > >
> > > Lou,
> > >
> > > Again, assuming your 1981 hull is built like my 1976 hull, the bow
> towing
> > > eye is behind a piece of decorative teak plywood in the extreme front
of
> > the
> > > V-berth area.  On my boat, there are a couple of flat head SS wood
> screws
> > > fastening the plywood to the cabin liner.  Unscrew those two wood
> screws,
> > > lift off the plywood, and you will be looking at the nuts & backing
> plate
> > of
> > > the bow towing eye.  You will need a deep socket wrench to loosen
these
> > > nuts.
> > >
> > > Yes, the 1995 AWD Astro minivan in the picture is our primary tow
> vehicle.
> > > Our Astro is rated to tow 4500 lbs, the middle of the 3 factory
offered
> > > towing packages.  It came with a transmission cooler.  It's a great
tow
> > > vehicle, perfectly adequate for towing the Rhodes 22.  I also tow my
Boy
> > > Scout troop trailer with the Astro, about 4000 lbs, tandem axle, fully
> > > enclosed.
> > >
> > > Thanks for the kind words regarding the mission trip to Florida.
There
> > are
> > > thousands of elderly folks and migrant worker families made homeless
and
> > now
> > > living out of their cars &/or in makeshift shelters built from
scrounged
> > > debris in the areas hit by these hurricanes!  We're looking at a
> > > humanitarian crisis of huge proportions right here in the United
States
> > and
> > > the press is completely ignoring it!  At times, it was hard to believe
> we
> > > were still in the United States.
> > >
> > > Roger Pihlaja
> > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Lou Rosenberg" <lsr3 at MAIL.nyu.edu>
> > > To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > Sent: Monday, October 25, 2004 11:26 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak on port side bow area of the 1983
> Rhodes
> > > 22
> > >
> > >
> > > >   Roger,
> > > >     Much thanks for your description of the construction of the hull
> > > > and rub rail.  I have to re bed my trailer U bolt and have had to
> > > > remove some of the screws holding the cabin liner.  Any words of
> > > > advice on how to get to that U bolt ?
> > > >
> > > >   On the blewskies site the photo of your gold Astro with your son
> > > > next to it.. I have the identical vehicle do you tow the boat with
> > > > the Astro?  How does it do uphill??
> > > >   Although I have the tow haul pkg  I plan to add the tranny cooler
> > > > when I get my hitch early in 05.  Rick C helped me get my trailer
> > > > from LI to Bklyn in August so I avoided a trailer expense this
season.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Some one who thought they could attach some sort of bumper to the
> > > > front of my R22 ( 81 hull) left 4 ugly holes on the topside of the
> > > > deck just above the rubrail.  I used polyester resin on the the
holes
> > > > and then gelcoated them now in the process of fairing and finishing.
> > > > I need to change my rub rail next year but I dont think its
leaking..
> > > > My poptop leak was from the hatch fasteners which are now being
> > > > rebedded.  Just gelcoated and reinforced my hatch.
> > > >   Someone had stepped on the leading edge and cracked it. my boat
was
> > > > badly abused and neglected.
> > > >   thanks again for that great description of the way to fix the rub
> > rail!!
> > > >   Lou
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >Steve,
> > > > >
> > > > >Assuming your 1983 hull is constructed like my 1976 hull, the
> hull/deck
> > > > >flange design resembles something like the lid of a shoebox.  The
> deck
> > > has a
> > > > >downward flange that overlaps the upper edge of the hull.  The
space
> in
> > > > >between the two components was filled with some sort of sealant &
> then
> > > the
> > > > >two were mechanically joined with pop rivets on about 18 inch
> centers.
> > > > >Finally, the rub rail was installed on the outside of the hull to
> hide
> > > the
> > > > >seam.  On the inside, the cabin liner also has a downward flange
all
> > > around
> > > > >the perimeter.  This cabin liner flange is nonstructural & there
> should
> > > be a
> > > > >decorative black vinyl molding thru bolted to the flange in order
to
> > > cover
> > > > >the hull/deck joint.  In order to inspect the hull/deck flange,
this
> > > > >decorative molding will have to be removed.  When you remove any
> pieces
> > > of
> > > > >this molding, be certain to mark the location it came from as well
as
> > > which
> > > > >end was facing towards the bow because these pieces/parts are not
> > > > >interchangeable.
> > > > >
> > > > >The shoebox type of hull/deck flange is a pretty good design &
really
> > > > >shouldn't cause a problem; but, I suppose it's possible the
hull/deck
> > > flange
> > > > >has developed a leak.  However, before removing the rub rail, I
would
> > > remove
> > > > >the decorative molding up in the V-berth area.  If the hull/deck
> joint
> > is
> > > > >leaking; then, the most likely source is one of the pop rivets.
With
> > the
> > > > >decorative molding removed, you will be able to pinpoint the leak.
> > > Assuming
> > > > >the leak really is a pop rivet, you will have to remove the section
> of
> > > rub
> > > > >rail and drill out the pop rivet.  Then, I would cover the inside
and
> > > > >outside of the pop rivet hole with a HD tape like duck tape.  Take
a
> > > > >hypoderdermic syringe and inject as much unthickened epoxy as you
can
> > > into
> > > > >the pop rivet hole.  Let the epoxy cure, drill out the hole, put in
a
> > new
> > > > >pop rivet (or machine screw & nut), and reassemble the whole thing.
> > > > >
> > > > >However, it's also quite likely that once you remove the decorative
> > > molding,
> > > > >you will see the hull/deck joint is not the source of the leak.  To
> > > locate
> > > > >the leak, seal yourself up inside the cabin.  Have an assistant
spray
> > > water
> > > > >on various thru bolted fittings on the foredeck and cabin top one
at
> a
> > > time
> > > > >for several minutes each while you inspect for leakage inside the
> > cabin.
> > > > >It's quite likely the source of the leak is something like a deck
> > cleat,
> > > > >cabin port, or rail stanchion.  It's also possible you have a crack
> in
> > > the
> > > > >foredeck in the nonskid or the toe rail and the water is running
> along
> > > the
> > > > >inside of the cabin liner for some distance before dripping out
where
> > you
> > > > >observe it.
> > > > >
> > > > >Tiny leaks like you have can be drive you nuts trying to track them
> > down!
> > > > >Good luck.
> > > > >
> > > > >Roger Pihlaja
> > > > >S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
> > > > >
> > > > >----- Original Message -----
> > > > >From: "steve" <stevej78 at comcast.net>
> > > > >To: <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > > >Sent: Sunday, October 24, 2004 11:27 PM
> > > > >Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak on port side bow area of the 1983
> Rhodes
> > 22
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >Roger,
> > > > >
> > > > >Good evening,
> > > > >
> > > > >I 'm a Rhodes 22 owner with a 1983 Rhodes.  I live in Bellevue,
WA.,
> in
> > > the
> > > > >Seattle area.
> > > > >
> > > > >There is a leak on the port side inside the v berth of the boat.
> > > > >
> > > > >It's a small leak in the in the berth that weeps from the on the
port
> > > side
> > > > >seams where the upper deck and hull meet..
> > > > >
> > > > >This leak seeps down along the port seam to the wooden support rail
> > which
> > > is
> > > > >fiber glassed in the bow.  The water continues along the rail to
the
> > end
> > > of
> > > > >the rail where now the exposed wood shows dampness.
> > > > >
> > > > >Would the rub rail and the black holding device for the rub rail be
> > > removed
> > > > >off around the nose of the boat and using a sealant calk the joint
to
> > > solve
> > > > >the leak?
> > > > >
> > > > >Please advise in stopping this leak.
> > > > >
> > > > >Thank you for your patience in reading this long email.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >Steve Jacobs
> > > > >
> > > > >Bellevue, WA
> > > > >
> > > > >Stevej78 at comcast.com
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > -
> > > > >----
> > > > >
> > > > >
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