[Rhodes22-list] Right-of-Way

[Herb Parsons]

Bill, I really hate to break this to you (OK, I really don't hat it at all), but most of the assertions below are simply wrong.

Commercial boats are not all "always restricted in the ability to maneuver". 30' crew boats are commercial boast. They're less restricted than my Coronado 35.
Fishing boats do indeed HAVE to have be towing their nets. That's what the regs say

"I don't think any of us seriously thought the sailboat had the right of way" Of COURSE not. He didn't maintain his course and speed. He went from a dead stop, pulled off the grounding he was stuck on, and slammed into the boat.


Herb Parsons

S/V O'Jure
1976 O'Day 25
Lake Grapevine, N TX

S/V Reve de Papa
1971 Coronado 35
Lake Pontchartrain, Louisiana Coast

>>> bill at effros.com 7/27/2006 10:37:56 am >>>
Wally,

Even though they are operating at unsafe speeds, it is clear both that 
they are unable to maneuver, and that you don't want to get hit by 
them.  You must give way when you see them coming.

Commercial boats have right-of-way any time they are restricted in their 
ability to maneuver.  That winds up being almost all the time.

Fishing boats don't have to have lines or nets or traps in the water 
attached to the boat to be "fishing".  A lobster boat going from trap to 
trap has the right of way -- and they know it!  They are sick and tired 
of panty waisted sailors getting in between them and their livelihood.  
This was one of the first right-of-way lessons I learned on my Sunfish 
on Long Island Sound.

The Law of Tonnage is the only one that really matters when you're out 
on the water.  Somebody posted a video of a sailboat cutting in front of 
a ferry.  I don't think any of us seriously thought the sailboat had the 
right of way.

Around here people in kayaks think they have the right of way because 
they are less maneuverable than sailboats.  Boating fatalities are 
soaring because of these people.  Even in boats as small as ours, you 
can't see them until it's too late.

People in small boats have to learn to stop doing stupid things.

Bill Effros

TN Rhodey wrote:
> Bill,
>
> First off I do everything I can to get out of the way of any boat. 
> Every boater is supposed to do everything they can to avoid accidents 
> including keeping a sharp look out and operating at safe speeds for 
> conditions.
>
> Driving a boat at 90 mph does not give one the right of way. You are 
> operating at unsafe speeds.
>
> A commerical boat does not always have right of way over sail boat 
> under sail. If the commerical craft is not restricted by channel or 
> towing they do not have right of way. Commercial fisherman do have the 
> right a way when they are actually fishing. They do not have right of 
> way when they are not fishing.
>
> Wally
>
>
>
>
>
>
>> From: Bill Effros <bill at effros.com>
>> Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>> To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Right-of-Way
>> Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2006 09:44:56 -0400
>>
>> Tom, Herb,
>>
>> Most people get this wrong.
>>
>> Here's the pecking order:
>>
>> (Summary of Coast Guard rules courtesy of the state of Tennessee)
>>
>> Responsibilities Between Vessels:
>>
>> If operating a power driven vessel you must give way to:
>>
>> o Any vessel not under command, such as an anchored or disabled vessel.
>> o Any vessel restricted in its ability to maneuver, such as a vessel 
>> towing, laying cable, or picking up navigation markers, or a vessel 
>> constrained by its draft such as a large ship in a channel.
>> o A vessel engaged in commercial fishing
>> o A sailing vessel (sail only) unless it is overtaking
>>
>> If operating a sailing vessel (sail only), you must give way to:
>> o Any vessel not under command
>> o Any vessel restricted in its ability to maneuver
>> o A vessel engaged in commercial fishing
>>
>> Michael and I sail in waters where we see all kinds of vessels 
>> (including submarines) all the time.  Every summer we read about a 
>> novice sailor getting killed while yelling "I've got the right of 
>> way!"  -- when in fact he doesn't.
>>
>> All military vessels have right-of-way over all other vessels.  Next 
>> comes the Coast Guard.  Next comes emergency vessels.  Next comes 
>> tugboats.
>>
>> Then comes vessels engaged in commercial fishing.
>>
>> But way up at the top are vessels not under command, and just below 
>> is any vessel restricted in its ability to maneuver.
>>
>> As a practical matter try to think of a commercial vessel that is not 
>> restricted in its ability to maneuver.  We already know that if you 
>> try to turn a cruise ship too fast it can tip over.  A Cigarette 
>> boat, traveling at 90 miles an hour, is restricted in its ability to 
>> maneuver.  Sailboats must give way -- early!
>>
>> Some of these big commercial boats have 40 foot drafts.
>>
>> I can't think of a commercial boat that wouldn't have right of way 
>> over a sail boat under sail--can you?
>>
>> Experienced sailors always follow "The Law of Tonnage": if something 
>> bigger than you is bearing down on you -- get out of its way!
>>
>> Bill Effros
>>
>> PS -- Anchored vessels must be in designated anchorages -- you can't 
>> anchor in the middle of a busy waterway and think for one second that 
>> you've got the right of way.  And if you're disabled, but the other 
>> boat can't maneuver, and can't give way...don't get disabled in front 
>> of big boats--it won't turn out well.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Herb Parsons wrote:
>>> I'm curious too. Commercial fishing vessels are stand on over sail 
>>> boats, when they're engaged in fishing. ANY boat (commercial or 
>>> other) limited in their ability to manuever and in a channel is 
>>> stand on over a sailing boat as well. But I believe that the blanket 
>>> statement that all commercial vessels have the right-of-way over any 
>>> sailing vessel is incorrect.
>>>
>>> Herb Parsons
>>>
>>> S/V O'Jure
>>> 1976 O'Day 25
>>> Lake Grapevine, N TX
>>>
>>> S/V Reve de Papa
>>> 1971 Coronado 35
>>> Lake Pontchartrain, Louisiana Coast
>>>
>>>
>>>>>> Tatflies at cs.com 7/26/2006 10:29:26 pm >>>
>>>>>>
>>> Bill,
>>>
>>> Why do commercial vessels have the right-of-way over any sailing 
>>> vessel (unless limited in their ability to manuever)?
>>>
>>> Tom T.
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