[Rhodes22-list] Pointing

Thu Nov 30 08:21:59 EST 2006

Bill,

I have experiemented with barber hauler rig as well. This creates somes 
problems unless you reroute sheet. Once you snatch sheet and pull back you 
will in effect have 3 jib sheets (on lee side) coming into the cockpit. 
Really it would be just one line but it will be doubled up inside shrouds 
and rest of sheet outside the shroud. The other option would be to snatch 
sheet and adjust using the part of line outside shrouds. This would be bad 
idea.

Wally

>From: "Peter Thorn" <pthorn at nc.rr.com>
>Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Pointing
>Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 12:27:56 -0500
>
>"It seems to me a snatch block deployed from somewhere could help the
>racers when they want to move their sails from the standard positions on
>their boats quickly and efficiently.  With long jib sheets you might not
>even have to change any of the rigging--just grab it in the middle with
>the snatch block."
>
>
>Bill,
>
>That's quite interesting, but I'm not sure exactly what you are talking
>about here.  Are you using some kind of  Barber hauler to pull the jib more
>inboard for a tighter sheeting angle?  If so, I would like to know more.
>Where exactly do you tack the snatch block and how do you adjust it?
>
>PT
>
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Bill Effros" <bill at effros.com>
>To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 12:10 PM
>Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Pointing
>
>
> > I don't race, so, for me, pointing is mainly an intellectual curiosity.
> >
> > I can point dead into the wind should I choose to do so.  Of course, at
> > this heading the wind will push me and my boat backward, so it is not
> > particularly useful except when backing into a  mooring after slightly
> > overshooting, or setting up a hove-to.
> >
> > As I fall off the wind, the boat goes forward faster and faster.  My
> > understanding of racing is that you must constantly calculate whether
> > you should fall further off the wind, and go faster, or point more
> > directly toward the destination you are trying to reach and go slower.
> >
> > It is clear to me that a J-Boat can point more directly into the wind
> > and go faster than I can go when pointing in the exact same direction.
> > On the other hand, when the wind dies down, and I unfurl my 175, there
> > are many points of sail on which I can beat a similarly sized J-boat
> > that is not flying more sail than I've got.
> >
> > I understand that the flatter I can keep my boat, the more speed I will
> > develop when sailing in any direction.
> >
> > When the 175 genny is unfurled only as far back as the mast, it has far
> > less sail exposed to the wind than a 100 genny unfurled to the same
> > point because of the cut of each sail.  So the 100 genny will go faster.
> >
> > I didn't have enough time on the water this summer to test my snatch
> > block (remember that one?), but what I wanted to do was to clip the
> > snatch block onto my windward rail, and pull the genny toward the
> > windward side of the mast to see what would happen in a pointing
> > situation.  I'll try it next year unless someone already knows it won't
> > help.
> >
> > It seems to me a snatch block deployed from somewhere could help the
> > racers when they want to move their sails from the standard positions on
> > their boats quickly and efficiently.  With long jib sheets you might not
> > even have to change any of the rigging--just grab it in the middle with
> > the snatch block.
> >
> > Bill Effros
> >
> > TN Rhodey wrote:
> > > Rex,
> > >
> > > I race single handed as well. If you plan ahead rerouting jib sheets
> > > is not a big deal. I don't race with pop-top up. I can secure tiller
> > > and walk forward to make the change in a few seconds. I am not sure
> > > that you really want a 175 inside the shrouds unless conditions
> > > require furling anyway. In that case sheeting inside provides better
> > > angles and would be worth rerouting sheets. I would think furling the
> > > 175 just so you can sheet inside shrouds would actually slow you down
> > > overall. Also add a vang. Proper use of vang and traveler will help
> > > you sail flatter in windier conditions. The biggest thing I missed
> > > with crew was the added rail weight. Also do you have a tiller
> > > extension? Most times when racing solo I am sitting forward in the
> > > cockpit...sometimes on the bench seat and sometimes on the rail.
> > >
> > > Wally
> > >
> > >
> > >> From: Charles Henthorn <rexh at sbcglobal.net>
> > >> Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > >> To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Thanksgiving sailing
> > >> Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2006 14:54:51 -0800 (PST)
> > >>
> > >> Thanks Slim --- forgot to mention I typically single-hand when
> > >> racing.  Good suggestion but probably would need to start using some
> > >> crew if I were to try re-rigging between course changes.
> > >>      Yes I agree that a slight back-wind of the genoa helps carry it
> > >> through to leeward -- if the sheets don't snag on the way.
> > >>   Rex
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Slim <salm at mn.rr.com> wrote:
> > >>   Rex,
> > >>
> > >> I wouldn't try the "double sheet" thing especially if you've been
>having
> > >> trouble getting the big 175 to come across without snagging on
> > >> something.
> > >> When tacking, I've found that I have to hold the jib sheet until I've
> > >> crossed through the eye and let the wind fill up the jib before I let
> > >> loose.
> > >> That usually works unless it's really light air. Another solution is 
>to
> > >> simply roll up the jib and pull it back out after you're about. This
> > >> can be
> > >> done pretty fast with experienced crew. It's definitely faster than
> > >> having
> > >> a sheet hooked on the bow cleat and someone has to go forward. Also
> > >> with a
> > >> little practice you can re-rig the sheets quickly and easily. If
> > >> you're on
> > >> a starboard tack, re-rig the starboard (slack) sheet first. Then when
> > >> you
> > >> come about re-rig the other side. You might be sailing with your pop
>top
> > >> down but if not, just FYI, a man of average height can reach the
> > >> sheets from
> > >> inside the cabin rather than going forward topside.
> > >>
> > >> Hope this helps. Good luck.
> > >>
> > >> Slim
> > >>
> > >> On 11/28/06 3:20 PM, "Charles Henthorn" wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > Anne:
> > >> > My Rhodes ( 88 recycled by Stan this past spring) is on Freeman
> > >> Lake, but
> > >> > I crew for a friend on Eagle Creek many times during the season.
> > >> I've never
> > >> > raced on Eagle Creek. They have a large J boat contingent at Eagle
> > >> Creek.
> > >> > Thanks for the invite to crew. We're northwest of Indy and probably
> > >> 3 hrs
> > >> > from KyLake area but if I get a chance to be in your area I'll give
> > >> you an
> > >> > email in advance.
> > >> > I had had some suggestions to run the rigging to the track inside 
>the
> > >> > outside shrouds but, with our lake lying in a snake configuration
> > >> and our
> > >> > distance courses being layed out around several points and tree
> > >> lines, our
> > >> > winds (Murphy's Law is always in play) gust or change dramatically 
>in
> > >> > intensity (especially in the spring and fall), having the genoa
> > >> running
> > >> > rigging on the inside of the shrouds takes the 'outside' option
> > >> away when it
> > >> > might be more effective if the winds are right. Has anyone tried
> > >> > 'double-rigging' with sheets running both inside and outside the
> > >> outside
> > >> > shrouds? I think it could be done if you lighten up on the sheets
> > >> so you're
> > >> > not dragging a lot of weight around but, even now, I'm finding it
> > >> difficult in
> > >> > light winds to get that big 175 to flow over to the leeward side on
> > >> a tack or
> > >> > gibe without the single set of sheets finding some cleat or port or
> > >> chainplate
> > >> > connection on which to hang up or snag. Before I try it (next
> > >> spring now with
> > >> > winter
> > >> > upon us), maybe someone has tried and found it successful or a
> > >> complete
> > >> > failure.
> > >> > Rex
> > >> >
> > >> > anima13 wrote:
> > >> > Rex,
> > >> > What lake are you on? Eagle Creek?
> > >> > I have to admit I sold my Rhodes....but I cannot give up this list,
> > >> these
> > >> > folks.
> > >> > I went to a bigger boat. I have sailed all winter on my Rhodes. One
> > >> year we
> > >> > sailed
> > >> > every weekend to Jan 1st and then we were out on Feb 1st.
> > >> > Racing....I have never raced my Rhodes, except for the KY Lake
> > >> gathering for
> > >> > Rhodes
> > >> > when we used to host a race here. Have to say, and I believe Rik
> > >> Sandberg
> > >> > would concur,
> > >> > I could really point that boat. You might try unfurling just less
> > >> than the
> > >> > whole 175%,
> > >> > like 160% or so.
> > >> > However, you are not going to point like the Flying Scot, etc.
> > >> Hence, PHRF!
> > >> > Wally races his R-22.
> > >> > I race on a team...race a J-34 now. We have raced together for
> > >> years. Our
> > >> > philosophy is to
> > >> > point hard and make the shortest distance. We sheet that jib in
> > >> tight as a
> > >> > drum and our
> > >> > helmsgal (John's wife Lisa) NEVER takes her eyes off the windex or
>the
> > >> > telltales. She is
> > >> > not allowed to do ANYthing else. We usually tell her "up" or "off"
> > >> so she
> > >> > does not have to look up
> > >> > to windex. On our long distance races she gets to rest on the
> > >> downwind...if
> > >> > we have enough staff.
> > >> > We have a 100 mile race in the spring and a 50 miler in the fall.
> > >> Lots of
> > >> > folks from Eagle Creek
> > >> > come here for those. A few were here last weekend and they are some
> > >> of our
> > >> > favorite friends.
> > >> > Come down and crew with us next year! We are ALWAYS hunting crew.
> > >> We require
> > >> > a minimum of 6
> > >> > for spinnaker. We took 9 on the 100 miler last year and were not
> > >> crowded!
> > >> > Too many jobs to do.
> > >> > Anne
> > >> >
> > >> > -----Original Message-----
> > >> > From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
> > >> > [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org]On Behalf Of Charles
> > >> Henthorn
> > >> > Sent: Monday, November 27, 2006 2:10 PM
> > >> > To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> > >> > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Thanksgiving sailing
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > Ann:
> > >> > Same here (mid-central western Indiana) --- great winds -- raced
> > >> > Saturday --- but cried all night last night having tarped my boat
> > >> yesterday.
> > >> > I would have guessed your season could extend more at Ky Lake than
> > >> here.
> > >> > Do you race your Rhodes. I'm finding I'm very competitive on the 
>runs
> > >> > but can't seem to get the 175% to point up enough on the reaches.
> > >> Do you
> > >> > race and, if so, have you found a way to point up higher than the
> > >> Santana's
> > >> > and Flying Scots I try to race against?
> > >> > Rex
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > anima13 wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > Man, did we have a BLOW-OUT weekend!!!!!
> > >> > Sailed all day Friday and 4 boats rafted up overnight.
> > >> > Played guitar, sang, ate and drank.
> > >> > Our friends from Indy came down so that gave it much more of a
> > >> > party-atmosphere. Sure were some gorgeous days on KY Lake.
> > >> > That is the lastest we have rafted-up. Our last latest was Nov 1st.
> > >> > Was cool in the night but the sun was very warm right away in the
> > >> > morning.
> > >> >
> > >> > Hope y'all had as great a time as we did.
> > >> >
> > >> > Anne
> > >> >
> > >> > __________________________________________________
> > >> > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > >> > __________________________________________________
> > >> > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
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> > >> > __________________________________________________
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> > >> > __________________________________________________
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> > >> > __________________________________________________
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