[Rhodes22-list] Politics-Palin-Twain
Ben Cittadino
bcittadino at dcs-law.com
Thu Dec 4 10:17:23 EST 2008
You know, Brad and Herb, I've been examining my conscience on the subject of
Sarah Palin. Is it just the fact that I disagree with her social
conservatism? Am I a sexist? Is it the tone of her voice? Does she remind me
of my first wife? I don't think it's any of those things.
Brad, you have alluded several times in the past to having led an active
dating life. Do you ever remember being out with a woman, gazing into her
eyes, and realizing that while the lights appear to be on, there is nobody
home. Well, THAT's how I feel about Sarah.
When she speaks it's just very clear that she has a relative few "mantras"
to which she holds on for dear life. Like most women, she can deliver a line
of sarcasm quite effectively, but she has nothing but a superficial grasp of
economics and world affairs ("On a clear day I can see Vladevostok"- Calvin
Trillin).
Since your perfect "gubmint" (Brad) wouldn't actually do much but stay out
of your way and let you make a living, maybe she is your ideal Chief Exec,
but man I just don't see it.
Merry Christmas,
Ben C.
Brad Haslett-2 wrote:
>
> Micheal,
>
> You made some interesting observations that most people don't think
> about, or don't want to think about. What drug us out of the Great
> Depression was not a multitude of make-work programs but WW2. Prior
> to Pearl Harbor we had the 16th largest military behind Poland. As
> Yamamato said whilst steaming back to Japan, "we have awakened a
> sleeping giant". Our success throughout the 50's and most of the 60's
> was largely the result of the rest of the industrialized world being
> left in tatters from the aftermath of the war. Those countries that
> experimented with Marx and Engels discovered that centralized economic
> planning never works so our success came easy. As a nation, we've
> started to believe our own hype that our being on top economically is
> the natural order of the universe. Things have changed. Europe has
> two huge economic problems they are facing, socialization and
> demographics. China is facing huge demographic problems in the next
> few decades as well (one child policy and an aging population) but
> they've cast off ideas of centralized planning have 20 years or so to
> stuff the piggy bank (my sister-in-law says 30). We in this country
> refuse to face the most basic of problems. The younger generation
> can't afford to fund the promises made to the Boomer generation -
> we'll either have to delay benefits, cut benefits, or raise SS taxes
> on younger workers. We've raised at least a couple of generations of
> entitlement minded workers. We have one of the most un-competitive
> corporate tax rates in the industrialized world. Historically, who
> ever had the cheapest energy and used the most energy was the most
> productive. We don't have a comprehensive energy policy unless you
> consider "you can't drill here, you can't mine there" a policy. You
> are indeed correct, this cycle may be long and it may be ugly. Even
> if it made good economic and fiscal sense, an Obama led public works
> infrastructure program would take years to get started (think
> environmental impact studies, eminent domain lawsuits, engineering,
> etc - this ain't 1932). Isolationism and restraint of trade won't work
> any better now than it did for Hoover. At some point in time, Obama
> will have to level with the American people and admit that he was a
> gas-bag promise generator during the campaign and now that he's in
> office, here's the ugly reality and here's what we're going to do
> about it. Short of that, he's playing "musical chairs" and playing it
> on the deck of the Titanic. I'm not holding my breath for honest
> answers. In the meantime, most of the world's oil is still being
> pumped by people who don't like us, Russia is on another power trip
> and using energy as a weapon, crazed Islamists haven't suddenly quit
> wanting to kill us, etc. Let's hope Ben is right and The One is
> surrounded by "The Best and Brightest" and this time they don't get us
> into the Bay of Pigs and Vietnam.
>
> Have a nice day!
>
> Brad
>
> On Wed, Dec 3, 2008 at 10:48 PM, michael meltzer <mjm at michaelmeltzer.com>
> wrote:
>> I here you, the bottom line is we do not "make things" any more, any when
>> the world wakes up that they do not need the Americas it going to be very
>> rough. The funny thing is from an economic standpoint we have simulating
>> like all sh-t with the war effort. I am not sure "o" is going to bring
>> much more to the table. Or if any policy in the short run will(like 1-2
>> years) This down turn is going to last until people get tired of it(which
>> seems to cure them all) or we get into a bigger war. The other issue is
>> the underlying trends are bad, many years ago I saw a very interesting
>> graph that plotted Americas by age/income producing by each age group
>> and compared it to the GDP. The idea was that each person cost and value
>> to sociality and the relationship changes based on age. By adding up all
>> the "cost and values" for everyone to form a macro picture (and this was
>> not touchy feely numbers, simply what you cost and what up make). It
>> turned out to be a perfect almost correlation with GDP. An using the
>> methods of any insurance actuarial the projection has the curve shifting
>> right about now to a decreasing GDP
>>
>> -mjm
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
>> [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Bill Effros
>> Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2008 9:42 PM
>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List
>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] bill?
>>
>> Michael,
>>
>> I like to think I'm in the "what's best for my country" camp, and
>> against the hypocrisy camp.
>>
>> George Bush got into office by saying one thing and doing another. I
>> opposed that.
>>
>> Obama got into office the same way. I oppose that, too.
>>
>> Both men are inexperienced, relying on the knowledge of those
>> surrounding them. It's a bad formula. The other people in the room
>> won't agree on many things. The least experienced person winds up
>> making the decision on a "gut feel".
>>
>> Both Bush and Obama were selected by political machines as the electable
>> face of unelectable policies.
>>
>> It didn't work well for the Republicans. It's not going to work well
>> for the Democrats, either.
>>
>> As you well know, we've got really really big problems. Things will
>> probably never go back to where they were. Our country's position is
>> likely to deteriorate, along with the position of most individuals.
>> There are smarter moves, and dumber moves. Moves that will leave us
>> better off, and moves that will leave us worse off.
>>
>> The Democrats are settling scores--they are not working for the common
>> good.
>>
>> As you know, I am voting against my pocketbook. The Democrat's policies
>> benefit me. If I lose, I win. But, at least I can live with myself,
>> having tried to work for what I believe is right.
>>
>> Maybe if enough people speak up early enough we can stop throwing our
>> money into a bottomless pit, and start actually working our way out.
>>
>> Bill Effros
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> michael meltzer wrote:
>>> Bill I am confused, I will admit it does not take much more me to be in
>>> that conduction but.....
>>>
>>> For the most part you have been in the democratic camp, what happened?
>>> It seems that "O" has you more than a little pissed off.....
>>>
>>> -mjm
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
>>> [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Bill Effros
>>> Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2008 7:01 PM
>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List
>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Politics - Palin - Twain
>>>
>>> David Brooks!
>>>
>>> One of the neo-cons who got just about everything wrong for the past 8
>>> years!
>>>
>>> Ben, why didn't you quote this from a more recent column:
>>>
>>> "Barack Obama and his team should put into action a foreign policy
>>> doctrine that builds on some of the ideas developed during George W.
>>> Bush's term."
>>>
>>> This isn't a football game, and it doesn't matter who you "root" for.
>>>
>>> This country is proceeding on an incoherent course which most ordinary
>>> Americans can see can't possibly work.
>>>
>>> The "Bailout" is already a fiasco -- and make no mistake, it's a
>>> Democrat fiasco.
>>>
>>> Bailing out auto unions is a payoff, plain and simple.
>>>
>>> Citibank paid $400 Million to call the new Mets stadium "Citi Field" --
>>> and now the taxpayers are giving them their money back--BRILLIANT!
>>>
>>> Obama is following exactly the same course Herbert Hoover followed after
>>> the stock market crash. Public works projects. Rooting for the home
>>> team.
>>>
>>> It didn't work then, and it won't work now.
>>>
>>> Maybe, just maybe, there's a better way. Obama was elected to bring
>>> change, not more of the same, and it's never too early to notice the
>>> emperor has no clothes on.
>>>
>>> Listening to David Brooks is not likely to be the better way, he's just
>>> another "well-educated" dope.
>>>
>>> Bill Effros
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Ben Cittadino wrote:
>>>
>>>> Folks;
>>>>
>>>> Mr Effros opines that "once again the country has decided to make the
>>>> dumbest person in the room the decider". I agree with Mr. Brooks of
>>>> the
>>>> NYTimes who wrote recently:
>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> "November 21, 2008
>>>> Op-Ed Columnist
>>>> The Insider's Crusade
>>>> By DAVID BROOKS
>>>> Jan. 20, 2009, will be a historic day. Barack Obama (Columbia, Harvard
>>>> Law)
>>>> will take the oath of office as his wife, Michelle (Princeton, Harvard
>>>> Law),
>>>> looks on proudly. Nearby, his foreign policy advisers will stand
>>>> beaming,
>>>> including perhaps Hillary Clinton (Wellesley, Yale Law), Jim Steinberg
>>>> (Harvard, Yale Law) and Susan Rice (Stanford, Oxford D. Phil.).
>>>>
>>>> The domestic policy team will be there, too, including Jason Furman
>>>> (Harvard, Harvard Ph.D.), Austan Goolsbee (Yale, M.I.T. Ph.D.), Blair
>>>> Levin
>>>> (Yale, Yale Law), Peter Orszag (Princeton, London School of Economics
>>>> Ph.D.)
>>>> and, of course, the White House Counsel Greg Craig (Harvard, Yale Law).
>>>>
>>>> This truly will be an administration that looks like America, or at
>>>> least
>>>> that slice of America that got double 800s on their SATs. Even more
>>>> than
>>>> past administrations, this will be a valedictocracy — rule by those who
>>>> graduate first in their high school classes. If a foreign enemy attacks
>>>> the
>>>> United States during the Harvard-Yale game any time over the next four
>>>> years, we're screwed.
>>>>
>>>> Already the culture of the Obama administration is coming into focus.
>>>> Its
>>>> members are twice as smart as the poor reporters who have to cover
>>>> them,
>>>> three times if you include the columnists. They typically served in the
>>>> Clinton administration and then, like Cincinnatus, retreated to the
>>>> comforts
>>>> of private life — that is, if Cincinnatus had worked at Goldman Sachs,
>>>> Williams & Connolly or the Brookings Institution. So many of them send
>>>> their
>>>> kids to Georgetown Day School, the posh leftish private school in D.C.,
>>>> that
>>>> they'll be able to hold White House staff meetings in the carpool line.
>>>>
>>>> And yet as much as I want to resent these overeducated Achievatrons
>>>> (not to
>>>> mention the incursion of a French-style government dominated by highly
>>>> trained Enarchs), I find myself tremendously impressed by the Obama
>>>> transition.
>>>>
>>>> The fact that they can already leak one big appointee per day is
>>>> testimony
>>>> to an awful lot of expert staff work. Unlike past Democratic
>>>> administrations, they are not just handing out jobs to the hacks
>>>> approved by
>>>> the favored interest groups. They're thinking holistically — there's a
>>>> nice
>>>> balance of policy wonks, governors and legislators. They're also
>>>> thinking
>>>> strategically. As Norman Ornstein of the American Enterprise Institute
>>>> notes, it was smart to name Tom Daschle both the head of Health and
>>>> Human
>>>> Services and the health czar. Splitting those duties up, as Bill
>>>> Clinton
>>>> did, leads to all sorts of conflicts.
>>>>
>>>> Most of all, they are picking Washington insiders. Or to be more
>>>> precise,
>>>> they are picking the best of the Washington insiders.
>>>>
>>>> Obama seems to have dispensed with the romantic and failed notion that
>>>> you
>>>> need inexperienced "fresh faces" to change things. After all, it was
>>>> L.B.J.
>>>> who passed the Civil Rights Act. Moreover, because he is so young,
>>>> Obama is
>>>> not bringing along an insular coterie of lifelong aides who depend upon
>>>> him
>>>> for their well-being.
>>>>
>>>> As a result, the team he has announced so far is more impressive than
>>>> any
>>>> other in recent memory. One may not agree with them on everything or
>>>> even
>>>> most things, but a few things are indisputably true.
>>>>
>>>> First, these are open-minded individuals who are persuadable by
>>>> evidence.
>>>> Orszag, who will probably be budget director, is trusted by Republicans
>>>> and
>>>> Democrats for his honest presentation of the facts.
>>>>
>>>> Second, they are admired professionals. Conservative legal experts have
>>>> a
>>>> high regard for the probable attorney general, Eric Holder, despite the
>>>> business over the Marc Rich pardon.
>>>>
>>>> Third, they are not excessively partisan. Obama signaled that he means
>>>> to
>>>> live up to his postpartisan rhetoric by letting Joe Lieberman keep his
>>>> committee chairmanship.
>>>>
>>>> Fourth, they are not ideological. The economic advisers, Furman and
>>>> Goolsbee, are moderate and thoughtful Democrats. Hillary Clinton at
>>>> State is
>>>> problematic, mostly because nobody has a role for her husband. But, as
>>>> she
>>>> has demonstrated in the Senate, her foreign-policy views are hardheaded
>>>> and
>>>> pragmatic. (It would be great to see her set of interests complemented
>>>> by
>>>> Samantha Power's set of interests at the U.N.)
>>>>
>>>> Finally, there are many people on this team with practical creativity.
>>>> Any
>>>> think tanker can come up with broad doctrines, but it is rare to find
>>>> people
>>>> who can give the president a list of concrete steps he can do day by
>>>> day to
>>>> advance American interests. Dennis Ross, who advised Obama during the
>>>> campaign, is the best I've ever seen at this, but Rahm Emanuel also has
>>>> this
>>>> capacity, as does Craig and legislative liaison Phil Schiliro.
>>>>
>>>> Believe me, I'm trying not to join in the vast, heaving O-phoria now
>>>> sweeping the coastal haute bourgeoisie. But the personnel decisions
>>>> have
>>>> been superb. The events of the past two weeks should be reassuring to
>>>> anybody who feared that Obama would veer to the left or would suffer
>>>> self-inflicted wounds because of his inexperience. He's off to a start
>>>> that
>>>> nearly justifies the hype."
>>>>
>>>> Copyright 2008 New York Times
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I don't remember writing off Presdent GW Bush early. In fact there was
>>>> great hope he could be the compassionate conservative, but he ran off
>>>> the
>>>> rails in ways we have already discussed. We're in a mess all right, but
>>>> if
>>>> it is possible to use our brains to get out of it, then Obama has
>>>> surely
>>>> recruited the best the most intelligent people in the country to get
>>>> down to
>>>> business.
>>>>
>>>> Remember David Brooks is well known and accepted as a conservative
>>>> Republican by all reasonable comentators. I'm going to withhold
>>>> judgment
>>>> and give Mr Obama his fair chance at tackling the issues, and I
>>>> encourage
>>>> everyone to do the same.
>>>>
>>>> Ben C.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> benonvelvetelvis wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Save me some room in the storm shelter (we hit water when we dig down
>>>>> here).
>>>>> I'll bring my share of the plastic sheeting and duct tape!
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
>>>>> [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Bill Effros
>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2008 15:30
>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Politics - Palin - Twain
>>>>>
>>>>> Rummy,
>>>>>
>>>>> We didn't have to wait for Bush to get into the White House to write
>>>>> him
>>>>> off.
>>>>>
>>>>> They both ran as "outsiders" and "agents of change" who were going to
>>>>> change Washington "business as usual".
>>>>>
>>>>> But what do we see? Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rahm Emanuel, Robert Gates,
>>>>> Hillary Clinton, Bill Richardson, Joe Biden--same people, different
>>>>> day.
>>>>>
>>>>> The Democrats are awarding the "spoils" to the people who elected
>>>>> them:
>>>>> Lawyers; Wall Street; Organized Labor; Big Farmers.
>>>>>
>>>>> Meanwhile, the country is spiraling downward, the Democrats will have
>>>>> to
>>>>> go to continuous feed web presses or larger denominations to print the
>>>>> money fast enough, the "global warming" opposition will be chucked
>>>>> under
>>>>> the bus as the "public works projects" start to gear up. The rest of
>>>>> the world has its own problems -- they're not going to bail us out
>>>>> this
>>>>> time.
>>>>>
>>>>> And what about Afghanistan? You think Vietnam was tough terrain? Not
>>>>> to mention the fact that Afghanistan is twice the size of all of
>>>>> Vietnam. How many soldiers did we have in South Vietnam when you were
>>>>> there? How many do you think it will take to lose in Afghanistan?
>>>>>
>>>>> There is zero evidence that this guy is a smart man. This country has
>>>>> again made the dumbest person in the room "the decider". I really
>>>>> didn't think people would make that same mistake again, but, here we
>>>>> are!
>>>>>
>>>>> Professional politicians continue to run this country. They are
>>>>> running
>>>>> it into the ground. We should let the banks go bankrupt; only
>>>>> profitable automobile companies will survive; if people overpaid for
>>>>> their homes they should give them up; if people don't have jobs they
>>>>> should stop going to the mall; if we think we've got to fight wars all
>>>>> over the place, lets draft the soldiers; building dams and roads will
>>>>> not make the earth greener; public works projects don't end
>>>>> depressions.
>>>>>
>>>>> We haven't heard one good idea from this guy. When push comes to
>>>>> shove,
>>>>> he always reneges. And you think we should wait for 4 years before
>>>>> we
>>>>> call him on it?
>>>>>
>>>>> Not me. We're heading for tough times, and everybody is to blame.
>>>>> But
>>>>> blaming won't help. Burning food, bailing out ridiculous union
>>>>> contracts, letting people live in homes they can't afford, printing
>>>>> more
>>>>> money, paying off debts with worthless paper -- will only make things
>>>>> worse. I'll speak up now.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bill Effros
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 2RumRunner at aol.com wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Bill,
>>>>>> Lighten up. Your blood vessels in your head are about to explode.
>>>>>> Obama
>>>>>> isn't even in the white house yet and you are writing him off
>>>>>> already.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, he
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> certainly has his hands full, cleaning up the mess from the last
>>>>>> eight
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> years,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> but he's a smart man and will get the job done. Cut him a little
>>>>>> slack.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> In
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> four years if he hasn't done a good job, then you can replace him.
>>>>>> Until
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> then,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> lighten up Francis.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Rummy
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In a message dated 12/3/2008 12:17:17 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
>>>>>> bill at effros.com writes:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Too bad it didn't work...she was unable to get out the Republican
>>>>>> vote
>>>>>> while Obama's field offices brought out the Democrats en masse...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's less than a month later, and the Democrats don't seem to have a
>>>>>> clue that they've got a real problem.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Did you notice that China has announced they aren't going to bail us
>>>>>> out
>>>>>> this time?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bill Effros
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Brad Haslett wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "The report of my death is greatly exaggerated" - Mark Twain
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So, Sarah came down to Georgia.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Brad
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chambliss: Palin 'allowed us to peak'
>>>>>>> By: Andy Barr
>>>>>>> December 3, 2008 11:29 AM EST
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Fresh off his runoff victory Tuesday night, Georgia Republican Sen.
>>>>>>> Saxby Chambliss credited Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin with firing up his
>>>>>>> base.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "I can't overstate the impact she had down here," Chambliss said
>>>>>>> during an interview Wednesday morning on Fox News.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "When she walks in a room, folks just explode," he added. "And they
>>>>>>> really did pack the house everywhere we went. She's a dynamic lady,
>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>> great administrator, and I think she's got a great future in the
>>>>>>> Republican Party."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chambliss said that after watching her campaign on his behalf at
>>>>>>> several events Monday, he does not see her star status diminishing
>>>>>>> within the party.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Republican also thanked John McCain and the other big name
>>>>>>> Republicans that came to Georgia, but said Palin made the biggest
>>>>>>> impact.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "We had John McCain and Mike Huckabee and Gov. Romney and Rudy
>>>>>>> Giuliani, but Sarah Palin came in on the last day, did a fly-around
>>>>>>> and, man, she was dynamite," he said. "We packed the houses
>>>>>>> everywhere
>>>>>>> we went. And it really did allow us to peak and get our base fired
>>>>>>> up."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But as Chambliss heaped praise on Palin and other big-ticket
>>>>>>> Republicans that came to Georgia on his behalf, he questioned why
>>>>>>> President-elect Barack Obama would not use his star power to aid
>>>>>>> his
>>>>>>> Democratic opponent Jim Martin.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "I have no idea why he didn't come down," Chambliss said.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "His people were here. His organization was here," he added. "They
>>>>>>> really did a good job in the general election of turning out
>>>>>>> people.
>>>>>>> And whatever their game plan was this time, if he had been here, I
>>>>>>> have no idea whether it would have worked better."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> (c) 2008 Capitol News Company, LLC
>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
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>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> __________________________________________________
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>>>>> 010)
>>>>>
>>>>>
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