[Rhodes22-list] Demasting

Mon Aug 16 14:25:21 EDT 2010

John,

It is evident from Bill's description of everything going over at once, the
rig failed because one of the forward inner stay chain plates failed.  The
forestay attached to the deck was merely decoration so far as supporting the
mast.  That is, the inner forward stays were doing the whole job of keeping
the mast from falling backward.

Re-attaching the forestay to the foredeck is a bad idea.  If you look at any
of the sailboat building standards, they mandate using chain plates to
anchor all shrouds.  No matter how strong you make the foredeck, the
foredeck-to-hull joint is still not built for the stress of supporting the
mast.

Rick

On Mon, Aug 16, 2010 at 10:52 AM, John Lock <jlock at relevantarts.com> wrote:

> Clearly attaching the forestay in that manner was dangerously
> inadequate.  That part of the deck is not reinforced to handle the
> loads generated by a full jib under sail.
>
> Since your boat seems to have something different about the anchor
> installation, you need to consider two alternatives:
>
> 1) Remove the anchor and mount it in some other fashion so the
> forestay and can be attached to a bow-mounted chainplate and secured
> properly.
>
> 2) Barring that, you should reinforce under the deck where the bolt
> passes thru with some stiff marine plywood or a chainplate and use one
> or two big, wide fender washers under the nut to spread the load out.
> Even so, I'd be cautious about that solution since the deck wasn't
> designed to do that.  You also have a nice hole to leak into the
> forepeak and deck core... sealing will be critical.
>
> Come to think of it... that may be why the rig failed!  Water leaking
> thru that mounting hole softened the deck core and allowed the washer
> and nut to be pulled straight thru.  Better check that area carefully
> and repair the deck core as necessary.
>
> Cheers!
> John Lock
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> s/v Pandion - '79 Rhodes 22
> Lake Sinclair, GA
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>
> On Aug 15, 2010, at 20:12, bdunn1 at aol.com wrote:
> > Fred:  Thank you.  The forestay was not connected to a chain plate.
> > The chain plate was covered with an anchor. Someone drilled a 3/8"
> > hole in the deck and put a 1/2' washer and nut. Pictures will show.
> > I am glad someone wasn't hurt.
> > Bill
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Fred Kaiser <fkaiser2 at gmail.com>
> > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > Sent: Sun, Aug 15, 2010 7:43 pm
> > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Demasting
> >
> >
> > I have pulled and re-bedded all ports on Fretless and was not able to
> > inspect the chain plates since there is only an inch or so clearance
> > between
> > the outer shell and inner liner.  Perhaps a strong light and mirror
> > would
> > help locate the chain plates but not sure you would be able to
> > determine
> > their condition.
> >
> > Fred Kaiser
> > Fretless
> > Rock Hall MD.
> >
> > On Sun, Aug 15, 2010 at 6:57 PM, David Culp <dculp at hsbtx.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Bill:
> >>
> >> Very sorry to hear of the incident but very glad to hear that no
> >> one was
> >> injured.  I have forgotten what year model you have and how it is
> >> setup.
> >> If
> >> the forestay mast pin had dislodged and the forestay failed with
> >> the kind
> >> of
> >> wind force you described, I can see that a weakened chain plate could
> >> possibly fail also when it takes on that huge transient load.  I
> >> would have
> >> thought that the other stays would have at least kept the mast
> >> intact.  I
> >> don't know of any way to inspect the chain plates on the Rhodes
> >> without
> >> pulling the windows out and then I am not sure what you can see.
> >> Next trip
> >> to the boat, I am going to pull the fore-peak anchor line box and
> >> have a
> >> look at my forestay chain-plate anyway.  It may be different then
> >> yours
> >> because it doesn't come through a "hole in the deck" that you
> >> describe.  It
> >> is mounted as a tab externally.  I have the forestay pin wrapped in
> >> sailing
> >> tape so that the cotter can't be removed/dislodged because I have
> >> seen that
> >> happen before and then the force on the pin is the only thing
> >> keeping it
> >> in.
> >>
> >> In aircraft, we have inspection covers in strategic locations to
> >> check
> >> important components.  This incident makes me wonder whether or not
> >> older
> >> boats (of any make) should have the chain-plates looked at.  I had
> >> been
> >> holding off doing so because I don't want to pull out a perfectly
> >> good
> >> window that isn't leaking just to check.  Maybe some inspection
> >> plates can
> >> be cut in the liner to do the same thing and then be trimmed off to
> >> look
> >> nice.  Or maybe we are just asking too much of the cabin top stays
> >> in this
> >> situation.  Hard to know.  Anyway, pictures would be very much
> >> appreciated
> >> as would Stan's take on this incident.
> >>
> >> Sincerely,
> >> David Culp
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Date: Sat, 14 Aug 2010 17:19:16 -0400
> >> From: bdunn1 at aol.com
> >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Demasting
> >> To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
> >> Message-ID: <8CD0A0D7C04E52A-1294-8E0B at webmail-m086.sysops.aol.com>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> >>
> >> This is to Stan although other may chime in.  Great sailing today;
> >> boat
> >> going 5.0 knots; everyone (wife and daughter) comfortably chatting
> >> when the
> >> jib let loose with a "gun-shot bang", went flying over the
> >> starboard side
> >> and took and mast with it.  Fortunately, we were on the port side
> >> so no one
> >> was hit with stays, etc.   One stay was ripped out of the cabin top
> >> but all
> >> others held.    Everything in the water.  Tied it up like an old
> >> whale and
> >> motored back to the house dragging the largest sea anchor made.  Took
> >> everything apart and discovered the bolt holding the jib was
> >> slightly bent
> >> but not broken - mysterious.  ( I will send Stan some pictures).
> >> The hole
> >> in the deck was not ripped and I couldn't see under it due to the
> >> anchor
> >> line box.
> >>
> >>
> >> I am not certain about the future except it would be good if you
> >> have a
> >> boat
> >> delivery nearby, or even it you don't, that it could be picked up
> >> and taken
> >> back to your shop?  We are on Lake George, NY.  I sold my trailer
> >> since we
> >> are on the lake. After you receive the boat we can discuss what is
> >> to be
> >> done.
> >>
> >>
> >> regards,
> >> Bill Dunn
> >> __________________________________________________
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