[Rhodes22-list] Ballast ?

Leland LKUHN at cnmc.org
Tue Jan 24 08:59:47 EST 2012


Spread,

My boat didn't tack well in high winds when I first got her but I added a
mod that took care of it--a more experienced helmsman.

The Rhodes has more sail and sheet adjustments than most boats and you can
lower her boom.  She has a huge rudder for her size and can pivot quickly on
her centerboard.

If I fail at my first casual attempt at a tack; I can come off the wind,
loosen my sheets for the new point-of-sail, pick up speed, and then turn on
a dime between waves.  Jibing may be easier but if I really must tack it
ain't that hard to electrically drop and electrically start the motor.

If you had endless reefing points and an easy method of reefing, deploying,
dousing, and storing your sails; you might convince me that the juice would
be worth the squeeze.  If I weren't so lazy.

But I do agree that IMF has its limitations.

Lee



Spreadgoodnews wrote:
> 
> I have also noticed comments that the R22 sails better with its water tank
> full.  Which is 15 gallons (120 pounds) under the v-berth.  I once had an
> 18' microcruiser that woulnt tack without considerable weight forward.
> We will have to experiment.
> 
> 
> 
> On Jan 23, 2012, at 10:36 PM, John Shulick <jsbudda at verizon.net> wrote:
> 
>> 
>> I see your point and will try this prior to drilling holes 
>> 
>> 
>> Spreadgoodnews wrote:
>>> 
>>> I think this does work pretty well.  The watertribe, everglades
>>> challenge
>>> people do some pretty cool stuff.  The sea-saw analogy is close, but
>>> weight above waterline has more effect than weight below waterline when
>>> heeling the windward weight will be clear of the water. Plus i am
>>> talking
>>> about putting it way out on the sides of the hull.  Centerline weight
>>> offers little righting moment until a certain amount of heel is present. 
>>> This is part of the reason twin keel boats  are very very stable.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Jan 23, 2012, at 10:15 PM, John Shulick <jsbudda at verizon.net> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Goodnews,
>>>> 
>>>> Thought experiments are good way to pass the time till sailing season
>>>> begins. The daggerboard with a torpedo would require extensive trunk
>>>> modification and some inventive engineering not to mention serious
>>>> dollars
>>>> which I can't allocate for now. I have a rough design in my head but
>>>> still
>>>> need to solve a few problems before going that far. The first thing to
>>>> do
>>>> is
>>>> close the slot temporarily with a plastic strip with the centerboard
>>>> down
>>>> and measure performance. I will do that when the water warms enough to
>>>> go
>>>> swimming this year. I understand your idea of moving the extra weight
>>>> out
>>>> to
>>>> the sides but wouldn't equal weight placed there cancel out? Picture a
>>>> see
>>>> saw with a 100 kid on each side. If I put the ballast inside it would
>>>> be
>>>> along the centerboard trunk so when the boat begins to heel the gravity
>>>> will
>>>> try to re center the boat. Bolting the ballast to the bottom of the
>>>> keel
>>>> gives a 2' mechanical advantage. Putting holes in the shoal keel and
>>>> sealing
>>>> them are not a big deal to me, I worked in the swimming pool business
>>>> for
>>>> 30
>>>> yrs. so I am wise to water and its ways. Actually a boat is novel to me
>>>> I
>>>> always had to keep the water in something now I'm trying to keep the
>>>> water
>>>> out of something. Ironic really.
>>>> 
>>>> John S
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Spreadgoodnews wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> I like your cognitive rumination.  I like your idea to play with some
>>>>> extra ballast.  Having a torpedo centerboard with the weight would be
>>>>> good
>>>>> because you can reverse it by putting your 70# diamondboard back in. 
>>>>> But
>>>>> you may need to add a winch and some stainless cable to lift a 200#
>>>>> board.
>>>>> As an alternative, try the physics of this idea.  In fact its not my
>>>>> idea
>>>>> but was on one of the participants of everglades challenge.  Put the
>>>>> weight equally divided on each side.  Under the port settee and under
>>>>> the
>>>>> galley against the hull outside the fore and aft stringers, not
>>>>> centerline.  Use coated lead shot weights like ankle weights or dive
>>>>> weights.  The idea is that as the hull heels you cantelever the weight
>>>>> out. The rhodes hull shape would make this work exceptionally well to
>>>>> my
>>>>> eye.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Jan 21, 2012, at 9:14 PM, John Shulick <jsbudda at verizon.net> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Slim, Lee, Goodnews,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I understand that I may not gain much and that I may end up removing
>>>>>> them
>>>>>> a
>>>>>> week after putting them on but how do you figure 200 lbs ballast
>>>>>> would
>>>>>> court
>>>>>> a potential catastrophe ? I have considered putting the weight in the
>>>>>> hull
>>>>>> but bolting it to the bottom of the shoal keel would add considerable
>>>>>> mechanical advantage over just sticking it under the floorboards. I
>>>>>> was
>>>>>> mistaken in my calculation of increase in whetted area it should have
>>>>>> been
>>>>>> 288 sq/in or ~ 2 sq/ft still just not that much IMO. It would be like
>>>>>> having
>>>>>> an extra invisible crew member who always knows when to switch sides.
>>>>>> If
>>>>>> 200lbs of ballast is such a radical mod, here's another thought. How
>>>>>> about
>>>>>> chucking the swing centerboard and replacing it with a retractable
>>>>>> dagger
>>>>>> board with a lead torpedo at the bottom? That would eliminate the
>>>>>> open
>>>>>> slot
>>>>>> in the hull which I believe to be a major drag component. Phillip
>>>>>> Rhodes
>>>>>> did
>>>>>> not design boats in the modern era of computer modeling and space age
>>>>>> materials. I wonder how he would build the R22 today ? 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Tinkerers of the world UNITE !
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> JohnS
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>> View this message in context:
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>>>>>> Sent from the Rhodes 22 mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> __________________________________________________
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>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>> 
>>>>> __________________________________________________
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>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>> 
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>>>> 
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>>> 
>>> __________________________________________________
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>> 
>> -- 
>> View this message in context:
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>> 
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> 
> __________________________________________________
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> 
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> 

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