From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com  Thu Nov  3 16:08:47 2022
From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich)
Date: Thu, 3 Nov 2022 16:08:47 -0400
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has become difficult
Message-ID: <93991526-33AC-48B1-925B-95ED3E817568@gmail.com>

The mainsail has become increasingly difficult to furl. It unfurls easily. Any thoughts?

Reuben Mezrich
Cell:410-499-8922
Pelican Cove in Sarasota and Back Bay in Boston 

From jayf401 at gmail.com  Thu Nov  3 18:13:07 2022
From: jayf401 at gmail.com (Jay Friedland)
Date: Thu, 3 Nov 2022 18:13:07 -0400
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Annapolis Show follow-up
In-Reply-To: <CADNTwiWVRj2W6Mh3xax52qbFmn4UFO0iD++iqP3WXnVSHStziQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CD2AA3F5-F9AE-4AE4-BECD-3F4ADC7428E8@gmail.com>
 <7D692C2E-010C-4B6E-9BA9-661C43B3885C@stottarchitecture.com>
 <DM6PR05MB698577949F5BAC913B5F1765C1299@DM6PR05MB6985.namprd05.prod.outlook.com>
 <2007138059.210999.1666098714371@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CADNTwiWVRj2W6Mh3xax52qbFmn4UFO0iD++iqP3WXnVSHStziQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <B545177B-6496-4F36-AB0B-2B491920B17A@gmail.com>

Joe,
I?m sorry I missed you when I was at the boat show. I had some questions on behalf of an interested party in the boat I?d like to ask you offline. My e-mail is <jayf410 at gmail.com <mailto:jayf410 at gmail.com>>. Thanks.

Jay Friedland
S/V Wanderlust ?97



> On Oct 18, 2022, at 1:47 PM, Chris Geankoplis <chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Yes good to see things went well and especially swing Stan in his apex
> spot.
> Chris Geankoplis
> Xenos
> 
> On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 8:12 AM daysails--- via Rhodes22-list <
> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote:
> 
>> The show boat looked great!  Big crowds and great weather.  Had a chance
>> to talk with The Man and spent a couple of hours answering questions as the
>> boat sold itself.  Lots of excitement and interest as usual round the
>> Rhodes?s 22 in that premier spot in the show.
>> Joe RileyAthens GA
>> -------------- next part --------------
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>>> 
>> 


From jpd9668 at gmail.com  Thu Nov  3 21:14:49 2022
From: jpd9668 at gmail.com (jpd9668)
Date: Thu, 03 Nov 2022 21:14:49 -0400
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has become difficult
In-Reply-To: <93991526-33AC-48B1-925B-95ED3E817568@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6364678f.050a0220.4b477.7c3d@mx.google.com>

Clean it. Start by hosing with fresh water get some spray sail cleaner and rinse. Try silicone spray. Make sure Boom is level and perpendicular with the mast. Rinse inside the mast with a hose to try and clean the bearings (the? donuts on the furler that turn inside the mast). Silicone spray. NOT WD40. If none if this works, call Stan.Joe DempseySV EespiteDeltaville, VASent via the Samsung Galaxy S22 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone
-------- Original message --------From: Reuben Mezrich <reuben.mezrich at gmail.com> Date: 11/3/22  4:09 PM  (GMT-05:00) To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has become difficult The mainsail has become increasingly difficult to furl. It unfurls easily. Any thoughts?Reuben MezrichCell:410-499-8922Pelican Cove in Sarasota and Back Bay in Boston 

From tvpolise at aol.com  Thu Nov  3 21:32:57 2022
From: tvpolise at aol.com (THOMAS POLISE)
Date: Thu, 3 Nov 2022 21:32:57 -0400
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has become difficult
In-Reply-To: <6364678f.050a0220.4b477.7c3d@mx.google.com>
References: <6364678f.050a0220.4b477.7c3d@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <AE340A81-AEFA-4F21-A8ED-030E8A64D0C8@aol.com>

I was having troubles till I realized I had thanksgiving mainsheet pulled tight when I was trying to furl. Make sure mainsheet is loose and boom level. 

> On Nov 3, 2022, at 9:14 PM, jpd9668 <jpd9668 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> ?Clean it. Start by hosing with fresh water get some spray sail cleaner and rinse. Try silicone spray. Make sure Boom is level and perpendicular with the mast. Rinse inside the mast with a hose to try and clean the bearings (the  donuts on the furler that turn inside the mast). Silicone spray. NOT WD40. If none if this works, call Stan.Joe DempseySV EespiteDeltaville, VASent via the Samsung Galaxy S22 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone
> -------- Original message --------From: Reuben Mezrich <reuben.mezrich at gmail.com> Date: 11/3/22  4:09 PM  (GMT-05:00) To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has become difficult The mainsail has become increasingly difficult to furl. It unfurls easily. Any thoughts?Reuben MezrichCell:410-499-8922Pelican Cove in Sarasota and Back Bay in Boston 


From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com  Fri Nov  4 08:49:49 2022
From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich)
Date: Fri, 4 Nov 2022 08:49:49 -0400
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has become difficult
In-Reply-To: <6364678f.050a0220.4b477.7c3d@mx.google.com>
References: <93991526-33AC-48B1-925B-95ED3E817568@gmail.com>
 <6364678f.050a0220.4b477.7c3d@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <CAHrO9muZYfk44dFLfUN6CuEu7bffjOWGh953GJgFB3AUWgNDCw@mail.gmail.com>

Joe
Thanks....where do I aim the silicone spray?
--Reuben
Reuben Mezrich
cell: 410-499-8922
Pelican Cove in Sarasota and Back Bay, Boston


On Thu, Nov 3, 2022 at 9:14 PM jpd9668 <jpd9668 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Clean it. Start by hosing with fresh water get some spray sail cleaner and
> rinse. Try silicone spray. Make sure Boom is level and perpendicular with
> the mast. Rinse inside the mast with a hose to try and clean the bearings
> (the  donuts on the furler that turn inside the mast). Silicone spray. NOT
> WD40. If none if this works, call Stan.Joe DempseySV EespiteDeltaville,
> VASent via the Samsung Galaxy S22 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone
> -------- Original message --------From: Reuben Mezrich <
> reuben.mezrich at gmail.com> Date: 11/3/22  4:09 PM  (GMT-05:00) To:
> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has
> become difficult The mainsail has become increasingly difficult to furl. It
> unfurls easily. Any thoughts?Reuben MezrichCell:410-499-8922Pelican Cove in
> Sarasota and Back Bay in Boston
>

From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com  Fri Nov  4 08:51:41 2022
From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich)
Date: Fri, 4 Nov 2022 08:51:41 -0400
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has become difficult
In-Reply-To: <AE340A81-AEFA-4F21-A8ED-030E8A64D0C8@aol.com>
References: <6364678f.050a0220.4b477.7c3d@mx.google.com>
 <AE340A81-AEFA-4F21-A8ED-030E8A64D0C8@aol.com>
Message-ID: <CAHrO9mvQNye8s9bnqqY71Tcj-fFSQj0iptd9Q2sQp8U6qc7SJA@mail.gmail.com>

Tom
Thanks....I mostly remember to release the outhaul before trying to
furl..this has become the first thing I check when I feels hard to furl
--Reuben
Reuben Mezrich
cell: 410-499-8922
Pelican Cove in Sarasota and Back Bay, Boston


On Thu, Nov 3, 2022 at 9:33 PM THOMAS POLISE via Rhodes22-list <
rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote:

> I was having troubles till I realized I had thanksgiving mainsheet pulled
> tight when I was trying to furl. Make sure mainsheet is loose and boom
> level.
>
> > On Nov 3, 2022, at 9:14 PM, jpd9668 <jpd9668 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > ?Clean it. Start by hosing with fresh water get some spray sail cleaner
> and rinse. Try silicone spray. Make sure Boom is level and perpendicular
> with the mast. Rinse inside the mast with a hose to try and clean the
> bearings (the  donuts on the furler that turn inside the mast). Silicone
> spray. NOT WD40. If none if this works, call Stan.Joe DempseySV
> EespiteDeltaville, VASent via the Samsung Galaxy S22 5G, an AT&T 5G
> smartphone
> > -------- Original message --------From: Reuben Mezrich <
> reuben.mezrich at gmail.com> Date: 11/3/22  4:09 PM  (GMT-05:00) To:
> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has
> become difficult The mainsail has become increasingly difficult to furl. It
> unfurls easily. Any thoughts?Reuben MezrichCell:410-499-8922Pelican Cove in
> Sarasota and Back Bay in Boston
>
>

From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com  Fri Nov  4 10:24:57 2022
From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich)
Date: Fri, 4 Nov 2022 10:24:57 -0400
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has become difficult
In-Reply-To: <6364678f.050a0220.4b477.7c3d@mx.google.com>
References: <93991526-33AC-48B1-925B-95ED3E817568@gmail.com>
 <6364678f.050a0220.4b477.7c3d@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <CAHrO9muBVE0dKb6Yuu30k6TSjfOADUF-AS+369N1yXcBkFg5gQ@mail.gmail.com>

Joe
A generous amount of silicone spray aimed at the lower bearing seems to
have helped a lot
Thank you for the suggestion
--Reuben
Reuben Mezrich
cell: 410-499-8922
Pelican Cove in Sarasota and Back Bay, Boston


On Thu, Nov 3, 2022 at 9:14 PM jpd9668 <jpd9668 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Clean it. Start by hosing with fresh water get some spray sail cleaner and
> rinse. Try silicone spray. Make sure Boom is level and perpendicular with
> the mast. Rinse inside the mast with a hose to try and clean the bearings
> (the  donuts on the furler that turn inside the mast). Silicone spray. NOT
> WD40. If none if this works, call Stan.Joe DempseySV EespiteDeltaville,
> VASent via the Samsung Galaxy S22 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone
> -------- Original message --------From: Reuben Mezrich <
> reuben.mezrich at gmail.com> Date: 11/3/22  4:09 PM  (GMT-05:00) To:
> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has
> become difficult The mainsail has become increasingly difficult to furl. It
> unfurls easily. Any thoughts?Reuben MezrichCell:410-499-8922Pelican Cove in
> Sarasota and Back Bay in Boston
>

From jpd9668 at gmail.com  Fri Nov  4 12:06:33 2022
From: jpd9668 at gmail.com (jpd9668)
Date: Fri, 04 Nov 2022 12:06:33 -0400
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has become difficult
In-Reply-To: <CAHrO9muZYfk44dFLfUN6CuEu7bffjOWGh953GJgFB3AUWgNDCw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <636538a8.370a0220.1a06b.c84f@mx.google.com>

Just spray it into the slot downward below the boom. If you look at the photo. The donuts are about a foot below the foot of the sail. (Actually, much closer because the sail in the photo was manually furled on the furling tube prior to re-installing in the mast.)Also I don't recall if the "donuts" actually turn or if the furling tube rotates inside the donuts. Zoom into the second photo and see the white colored sleeves/bearings.In any event, best to do with the sail unfurled on a calm day spray the tube itself as well as the donuts. You're not going to have very good access but just hope you get the spray on the surfaces. There maybe somebody on the list that can add to this or have better information.The ideal or correct method would be with the mast down and pull out the furling tube.Hope this helps.Joe DempseySV RespiteDeltaville, VASent via the Samsung Galaxy S22 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone
-------- Original message --------From: Reuben Mezrich <reuben.mezrich at gmail.com> Date: 11/4/22  8:50 AM  (GMT-05:00) To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has become difficult JoeThanks....where do I aim the silicone spray?--ReubenReuben Mezrichcell: 410-499-8922Pelican Cove in Sarasota and Back Bay, BostonOn Thu, Nov 3, 2022 at 9:14 PM jpd9668 <jpd9668 at gmail.com> wrote:> Clean it. Start by hosing with fresh water get some spray sail cleaner and> rinse. Try silicone spray. Make sure Boom is level and perpendicular with> the mast. Rinse inside the mast with a hose to try and clean the bearings> (the? donuts on the furler that turn inside the mast). Silicone spray. NOT> WD40. If none if this works, call Stan.Joe DempseySV EespiteDeltaville,> VASent via the Samsung Galaxy S22 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone> -------- Original message --------From: Reuben Mezrich <> reuben.mezrich at gmail.com> Date: 11/3/22? 4:09 PM? (GMT-05:00) To:> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has> become difficult The mainsail has become increasingly difficult to furl. It> unfurls easily. Any thoughts?Reuben MezrichCell:410-499-8922Pelican Cove in> Sarasota and Back Bay in Boston>
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From jpd9668 at gmail.com  Fri Nov  4 12:09:38 2022
From: jpd9668 at gmail.com (jpd9668)
Date: Fri, 04 Nov 2022 12:09:38 -0400
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has become difficult
In-Reply-To: <CAHrO9muBVE0dKb6Yuu30k6TSjfOADUF-AS+369N1yXcBkFg5gQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <63653943.370a0220.1a06b.c8a8@mx.google.com>

Great. Generous is good!Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S22 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone
-------- Original message --------From: Reuben Mezrich <reuben.mezrich at gmail.com> Date: 11/4/22  10:25 AM  (GMT-05:00) To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has become difficult JoeA generous amount of silicone spray aimed at the lower bearing seems tohave helped a lotThank you for the suggestion--ReubenReuben Mezrichcell: 410-499-8922Pelican Cove in Sarasota and Back Bay, BostonOn Thu, Nov 3, 2022 at 9:14 PM jpd9668 <jpd9668 at gmail.com> wrote:> Clean it. Start by hosing with fresh water get some spray sail cleaner and> rinse. Try silicone spray. Make sure Boom is level and perpendicular with> the mast. Rinse inside the mast with a hose to try and clean the bearings> (the? donuts on the furler that turn inside the mast). Silicone spray. NOT> WD40. If none if this works, call Stan.Joe DempseySV EespiteDeltaville,> VASent via the Samsung Galaxy S22 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone> -------- Original message --------From: Reuben Mezrich <> reuben.mezrich at gmail.com> Date: 11/3/22? 4:09 PM? (GMT-05:00) To:> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has> become difficult The mainsail has become increasingly difficult to furl. It> unfurls easily. Any thoughts?Reuben MezrichCell:410-499-8922Pelican Cove in> Sarasota and Back Bay in Boston>

From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com  Sat Nov  5 06:34:51 2022
From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (Jeff Smith Photo)
Date: Sat, 5 Nov 2022 06:34:51 -0400
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mainsail furling has become difficult
Message-ID: <CAM0HAmndodLsFO5yAGMXpSD_Wicm5UyhzwNdCyDnvpf_auE-iw@mail.gmail.com>

A baggy mainsail can also effect furling.

Best Regards
Jeff Smith
www.http://JeffSmithPhoto.Net
732-236-1368

From lvjkuhn at gmail.com  Fri Nov 11 16:05:39 2022
From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee Kuhn)
Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2022 16:05:39 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Stuck/Frozen Trailer Wheel
Message-ID: <CAPgvAEkNrveDFZn-5s6cwUGo+4knKrF9c4YrVbd9DUrtGYX3JQ@mail.gmail.com>

Happy Veterans Day!

One of the wheels on my dual-axle Triad trailer does not turn.

I've tried rocking back and forth, and banging on the rim near the
brake pads to try to loosen them up  Didn't work.

Couldn't find anything in the archives.  Any ideas?

Thanks!

Lee
1999 Rhodes22  AT EASE
Claytor Lake, VA

From rnelson204 at gmail.com  Fri Nov 11 16:38:23 2022
From: rnelson204 at gmail.com (RODNEY BROWN)
Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2022 15:38:23 -0600
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Stuck/Frozen Trailer Wheel
In-Reply-To: <CAPgvAEkNrveDFZn-5s6cwUGo+4knKrF9c4YrVbd9DUrtGYX3JQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPgvAEkNrveDFZn-5s6cwUGo+4knKrF9c4YrVbd9DUrtGYX3JQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9B09F77D-7DA1-4B3C-9CF7-476C221E90F1@gmail.com>

Have you tried jacking it up to see if you can get the wheel to turn? If it locked up it could be a seized bearing? Just a thought


> On Nov 11, 2022, at 3:05 PM, Lee Kuhn <lvjkuhn at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Happy Veterans Day!
> 
> One of the wheels on my dual-axle Triad trailer does not turn.
> 
> I've tried rocking back and forth, and banging on the rim near the
> brake pads to try to loosen them up  Didn't work.
> 
> Couldn't find anything in the archives.  Any ideas?
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Lee
> 1999 Rhodes22  AT EASE
> Claytor Lake, VA


From lvjkuhn at gmail.com  Fri Nov 11 16:44:49 2022
From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee Kuhn)
Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2022 16:44:49 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Stuck/Frozen Trailer Wheel
In-Reply-To: <9B09F77D-7DA1-4B3C-9CF7-476C221E90F1@gmail.com>
References: <CAPgvAEkNrveDFZn-5s6cwUGo+4knKrF9c4YrVbd9DUrtGYX3JQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <9B09F77D-7DA1-4B3C-9CF7-476C221E90F1@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAPgvAEkqZ=6QbHfUGzrj63epDyLcZd0TpLGZupb9kF3nz-DP_w@mail.gmail.com>

I was hoping for an easier fix but that could be it.

On Fri, Nov 11, 2022, 4:38 PM RODNEY BROWN <rnelson204 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Have you tried jacking it up to see if you can get the wheel to turn? If
> it locked up it could be a seized bearing? Just a thought
>
>
> > On Nov 11, 2022, at 3:05 PM, Lee Kuhn <lvjkuhn at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Happy Veterans Day!
> >
> > One of the wheels on my dual-axle Triad trailer does not turn.
> >
> > I've tried rocking back and forth, and banging on the rim near the
> > brake pads to try to loosen them up  Didn't work.
> >
> > Couldn't find anything in the archives.  Any ideas?
> >
> > Thanks!
> >
> > Lee
> > 1999 Rhodes22  AT EASE
> > Claytor Lake, VA
>
>

From jpd9668 at gmail.com  Fri Nov 11 18:27:45 2022
From: jpd9668 at gmail.com (jpd9668)
Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2022 18:27:45 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Stuck/Frozen Trailer Wheel
In-Reply-To: <CAPgvAEkNrveDFZn-5s6cwUGo+4knKrF9c4YrVbd9DUrtGYX3JQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <636eda72.c80a0220.46704.7326@mx.google.com>

It's one of two things: brakes (probably not if they're surge brakes) or bearings.1. Do you allow your wheels to cool before launching? If not, and they're still hot when you back into the water, the rapid cooling sucks water into the hub and onto the bearing capsule.?2. If your answer is "no" to 1 above, do you keep a grease gun with marine lube in your vehicle?3. If the answer is "yes" to 2 above, do you lube your hubs after launching or retrieving?4. If the answer is either "no to 2 above and/or "no" to 3 above, problem solved. It's your bearings and they've got to be replaced.The good news is you've got a two axle trailer so you can remove that wheel and take the trailer to a shop unless you are going to try and replace the bearings yourself. I DONT RECOMMEND THAT OPTION unless your a real good mechanic familiar with those bearing cups and seals that are special for boat trailers.Hope this helps.Joe DempseyS/V RespiteDeltaville, VASent via the Samsung Galaxy S22 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone
-------- Original message --------From: Lee Kuhn <lvjkuhn at gmail.com> Date: 11/11/22  4:06 PM  (GMT-05:00) To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Stuck/Frozen Trailer Wheel Happy Veterans Day!One of the wheels on my dual-axle Triad trailer does not turn.I've tried rocking back and forth, and banging on the rim near thebrake pads to try to loosen them up? Didn't work.Couldn't find anything in the archives.? Any ideas?Thanks!Lee1999 Rhodes22? AT EASEClaytor Lake, VA

From roger_pihlaja at msn.com  Fri Nov 11 18:32:10 2022
From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA)
Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2022 23:32:10 +0000
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Stuck/Frozen Trailer Wheel
In-Reply-To: <CAPgvAEkqZ=6QbHfUGzrj63epDyLcZd0TpLGZupb9kF3nz-DP_w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPgvAEkNrveDFZn-5s6cwUGo+4knKrF9c4YrVbd9DUrtGYX3JQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <9B09F77D-7DA1-4B3C-9CF7-476C221E90F1@gmail.com>
 <CAPgvAEkqZ=6QbHfUGzrj63epDyLcZd0TpLGZupb9kF3nz-DP_w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CY8PR10MB668321B6B4FE09EE3E621CAB80009@CY8PR10MB6683.namprd10.prod.outlook.com>

Lee,

Have you tried towing it a short distance both forward and reverse?  About the only things it can be is stuck brakes or a seized bearing.  Either way, if it doesn?t come free by towing it, you will have to jack it up and remove the wheel to inspect.

Roger Pihlaja
S/V Dynamic Equilibrium 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 11, 2022, at 4:45 PM, Lee Kuhn <lvjkuhn at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> ?I was hoping for an easier fix but that could be it.
> 
>> On Fri, Nov 11, 2022, 4:38 PM RODNEY BROWN <rnelson204 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Have you tried jacking it up to see if you can get the wheel to turn? If
>> it locked up it could be a seized bearing? Just a thought
>> 
>> 
>>>> On Nov 11, 2022, at 3:05 PM, Lee Kuhn <lvjkuhn at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Happy Veterans Day!
>>> 
>>> One of the wheels on my dual-axle Triad trailer does not turn.
>>> 
>>> I've tried rocking back and forth, and banging on the rim near the
>>> brake pads to try to loosen them up  Didn't work.
>>> 
>>> Couldn't find anything in the archives.  Any ideas?
>>> 
>>> Thanks!
>>> 
>>> Lee
>>> 1999 Rhodes22  AT EASE
>>> Claytor Lake, VA
>> 
>> 

From peter at sunnybeeches.com  Sat Nov 12 12:56:14 2022
From: peter at sunnybeeches.com (Peter Nyberg)
Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2022 09:56:14 -0800
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Stuck/Frozen Trailer Wheel
Message-ID: <E1otujm-005eqw-Hr@s152.servername.online>

I also have the dual-axle Triad, and have also had problems with wheels becoming frozen.  In both instances, I had to remove the offending wheel in order to take the trailer to be serviced. After the second time, I asked if there was something they could do to make the problem less likely to reoccur.  They said there was, and installed disc brakes on all 4 wheels.  The cost was north of $1500.

BTW, I launch and retrieve in salt water multiple times per year.  

Peter Nyberg
Coventry, CT
s/v Silverheels (1988/2016)

> On 2022-11-11, at 16:05:39 EST, Lee Kuhn wrote:
>
> Happy Veterans Day!
> 
> One of the wheels on my dual-axle Triad trailer does not turn.
> 
> I've tried rocking back and forth, and banging on the rim near the brake pads to 
> try to loosen them up  Didn't work. 
> 
> Couldn't find anything in the archives.  Any ideas?
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Lee
> 1999 Rhodes22  AT EASE
> Claytor Lake, VA
> 


From dwbrad at gmail.com  Sat Nov 12 14:03:23 2022
From: dwbrad at gmail.com (David Bradley)
Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2022 14:03:23 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Stuck/Frozen Trailer Wheel
In-Reply-To: <E1otujm-005eqw-Hr@s152.servername.online>
References: <E1otujm-005eqw-Hr@s152.servername.online>
Message-ID: <4C923BB9-1890-4DEB-B1F2-8B85C7E15360@gmail.com>

I had that same problem. A heavy mallet (smaller than a sledge hammer, bigger than a regular carpenter?s hammer) with very hard pounding on the back of the drum finally freed it. I ended up replacing the drums and brakes. 

Dave

> On Nov 12, 2022, at 12:56 PM, Peter Nyberg <peter at sunnybeeches.com> wrote:
> 
> I also have the dual-axle Triad, and have also had problems with wheels becoming frozen.  In both instances, I had to remove the offending wheel in order to take the trailer to be serviced. After the second time, I asked if there was something they could do to make the problem less likely to reoccur.  They said there was, and installed disc brakes on all 4 wheels.  The cost was north of $1500.
> 
> BTW, I launch and retrieve in salt water multiple times per year.  
> 
> Peter Nyberg
> Coventry, CT
> s/v Silverheels (1988/2016)
> 
>> On 2022-11-11, at 16:05:39 EST, Lee Kuhn wrote:
>> 
>> Happy Veterans Day!
>> 
>> One of the wheels on my dual-axle Triad trailer does not turn.
>> 
>> I've tried rocking back and forth, and banging on the rim near the brake pads to 
>> try to loosen them up  Didn't work. 
>> 
>> Couldn't find anything in the archives.  Any ideas?
>> 
>> Thanks!
>> 
>> Lee
>> 1999 Rhodes22  AT EASE
>> Claytor Lake, VA
>> 
> 


From lgioia at yahoo.com  Sun Nov 13 09:15:36 2022
From: lgioia at yahoo.com (Larry Gioia)
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2022 09:15:36 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Stuck/Frozen Trailer Wheel
In-Reply-To: <4C923BB9-1890-4DEB-B1F2-8B85C7E15360@gmail.com>
References: <4C923BB9-1890-4DEB-B1F2-8B85C7E15360@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <0C610323-83B2-4FDE-AD89-CE0E3FEEBDB4@yahoo.com>

I have a single-axle trailer (don?t know the make, maybe Triad?) that came with the used ?86 R22 I bought in 2020 - no brakes.  I rarely use it as the boat stays in the water on a small lake here in Tampa, but these emails make me think towing the boat with it isn?t a great idea. I towed it 45 minutes through St Pete & Clearwater when I first bought it - got a flat as the tires & wheels were in bad condition so I replaced them. I didn?t notice any issue with stopping but it was light traffic. 
  
Larry

> On Nov 12, 2022, at 2:03 PM, David Bradley <dwbrad at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> ?I had that same problem. A heavy mallet (smaller than a sledge hammer, bigger than a regular carpenter?s hammer) with very hard pounding on the back of the drum finally freed it. I ended up replacing the drums and brakes. 
> 
> Dave
> 
>> On Nov 12, 2022, at 12:56 PM, Peter Nyberg <peter at sunnybeeches.com> wrote:
>> 
>> I also have the dual-axle Triad, and have also had problems with wheels becoming frozen.  In both instances, I had to remove the offending wheel in order to take the trailer to be serviced. After the second time, I asked if there was something they could do to make the problem less likely to reoccur.  They said there was, and installed disc brakes on all 4 wheels.  The cost was north of $1500.
>> 
>> BTW, I launch and retrieve in salt water multiple times per year.  
>> 
>> Peter Nyberg
>> Coventry, CT
>> s/v Silverheels (1988/2016)
>> 
>>>> On 2022-11-11, at 16:05:39 EST, Lee Kuhn wrote:
>>> 
>>> Happy Veterans Day!
>>> 
>>> One of the wheels on my dual-axle Triad trailer does not turn.
>>> 
>>> I've tried rocking back and forth, and banging on the rim near the brake pads to 
>>> try to loosen them up  Didn't work. 
>>> 
>>> Couldn't find anything in the archives.  Any ideas?
>>> 
>>> Thanks!
>>> 
>>> Lee
>>> 1999 Rhodes22  AT EASE
>>> Claytor Lake, VA
>>> 
>> 
> 


From lvjkuhn at gmail.com  Sun Nov 13 11:09:58 2022
From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee Kuhn)
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2022 11:09:58 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Stuck/Frozen Trailer Wheel
In-Reply-To: <0C610323-83B2-4FDE-AD89-CE0E3FEEBDB4@yahoo.com>
References: <4C923BB9-1890-4DEB-B1F2-8B85C7E15360@gmail.com>
 <0C610323-83B2-4FDE-AD89-CE0E3FEEBDB4@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAPgvAEn7+LsdoxRc29VxzUR6As2CheRmbqzLA8Sksk=fqSdjYw@mail.gmail.com>

As always, good advice from everyone on the List.  After Googling lots of
potential issues and watching a variety of YouTube videos, here's how I
tried to fix the problem.

1.  Drove back and forth to try to unfreeze the brake.
2.  Tried to remove the rubber grommets and adjust the tension on the
brake.  A Triad dual-axle trailer has drop-down axles which cover the
access to the adjuster.  Good for the boat riding low on the trailer.  Bad
for an easy brake fix.
3.  Bought a small ramp which is much easier than a jack if you have a
dual-axle.  Drive one tire up on the ramp and the other slightly lifts off
of the ground.  I removed the tire and carefully yet forcefully banged on
the drum near the brake pads.
4.  Called a friend who owned a trailer company.  Obviously should have
done that from the start.
5.  Removed the drum.  The brake pads were de-laminated.  For the extra
money it was worth it to buy the entire 10 x 2.25 single servo hydraulic
brake assembly.  Problem solved.

Thanks for all your help!

Lee

On Sun, Nov 13, 2022 at 9:15 AM Larry Gioia via Rhodes22-list <
rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote:

> I have a single-axle trailer (don?t know the make, maybe Triad?) that came
> with the used ?86 R22 I bought in 2020 - no brakes.  I rarely use it as the
> boat stays in the water on a small lake here in Tampa, but these emails
> make me think towing the boat with it isn?t a great idea. I towed it 45
> minutes through St Pete & Clearwater when I first bought it - got a flat as
> the tires & wheels were in bad condition so I replaced them. I didn?t
> notice any issue with stopping but it was light traffic.
>
> Larry
>
> > On Nov 12, 2022, at 2:03 PM, David Bradley <dwbrad at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > ?I had that same problem. A heavy mallet (smaller than a sledge hammer,
> bigger than a regular carpenter?s hammer) with very hard pounding on the
> back of the drum finally freed it. I ended up replacing the drums and
> brakes.
> >
> > Dave
> >
> >> On Nov 12, 2022, at 12:56 PM, Peter Nyberg <peter at sunnybeeches.com>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> I also have the dual-axle Triad, and have also had problems with wheels
> becoming frozen.  In both instances, I had to remove the offending wheel in
> order to take the trailer to be serviced. After the second time, I asked if
> there was something they could do to make the problem less likely to
> reoccur.  They said there was, and installed disc brakes on all 4 wheels.
> The cost was north of $1500.
> >>
> >> BTW, I launch and retrieve in salt water multiple times per year.
> >>
> >> Peter Nyberg
> >> Coventry, CT
> >> s/v Silverheels (1988/2016)
> >>
> >>>> On 2022-11-11, at 16:05:39 EST, Lee Kuhn wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Happy Veterans Day!
> >>>
> >>> One of the wheels on my dual-axle Triad trailer does not turn.
> >>>
> >>> I've tried rocking back and forth, and banging on the rim near the
> brake pads to
> >>> try to loosen them up  Didn't work.
> >>>
> >>> Couldn't find anything in the archives.  Any ideas?
> >>>
> >>> Thanks!
> >>>
> >>> Lee
> >>> 1999 Rhodes22  AT EASE
> >>> Claytor Lake, VA
> >>>
> >>
> >
>
>

From lucy.forrest at gmail.com  Sat Nov 19 18:57:46 2022
From: lucy.forrest at gmail.com (Lucy Forrest)
Date: Sat, 19 Nov 2022 18:57:46 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Torqeedo propulsion system for sale
Message-ID: <CAJ7bjK-PPF_jgMNVnNW-n9AJJkBnpKOHecYqjMjqccSSDB=-5w@mail.gmail.com>

We have just sold our beloved Rhodes 22 and, as her new owner has their own
outboard motor, we are now selling our complete Torqeedo propulsion system
separately, at a GREAT price.

Details and link to photos and videos are available on CraigsList (Southern
MD)
https://smd.craigslist.org/bpo/d/north-beach-torqeedo-propulsion-system/7559428512.html
We're willing to deliver to a Rhodie (within reason!).

NOTE: The 4.0R is compatible with Stan's motor-tiller linker system and we
can provide an adapter upon request.

Lucy
s/v Steady State (no more!)

From C.Robert.Lester at dartmouth.edu  Fri Nov 25 17:09:29 2022
From: C.Robert.Lester at dartmouth.edu (C. Robert Lester)
Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2022 22:09:29 +0000
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
In-Reply-To: <2FFC3BEA-7D55-468A-8ADF-8B4380600DE4@ebsmed.com>
References: <CY4PR03MB2630CBFA5AE018C339784C0EAE470@CY4PR03MB2630.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>
 <009b01d284af$8a3666d0$9ea33470$@ebsmed.com>
 <000301d284df$a48d68f0$eda83ad0$@ca>
 <CY4PR03MB263071E62D91D35B31036B14AE5F0@CY4PR03MB2630.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>
 <007901d28a69$994e4b50$cbeae1f0$@ca>
 <BN6PR03MB2626B45DAD3C69A31F067A38AE5C0@BN6PR03MB2626.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>
 <BN6PR03MB2626CA2EC56182B6C8C33C9EAE590@BN6PR03MB2626.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>
 <2FFC3BEA-7D55-468A-8ADF-8B4380600DE4@ebsmed.com>
Message-ID: <MW5PR03MB687965357EA3228721B02D76AE0E9@MW5PR03MB6879.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>

I'm the new owner of a rudder off an '82 R22.
Cannot wait to sail / race next sailing season.
Took some pics of my '84 Rudder (curved, black/red) and '82 Rudder (white) side by side.
The boats are only 2 years apart but the rudder heads as well as the rudders are not similar at all.
I was going to buy the '82 stern rail as well but that is even a different mount and size from my '84.
Comments, questions?

Thanks all,
Bob
'84 ORION



> Bob:
> 
> Can you post a picture of the rudder? 
> I wonder if the rudder is curved or instead has "swollen" on one side due to water migration into the core - especially if the rudder has been exposed to freezing. When I rebuilt my rudder I found that there were large voids in it and undertook to fill them with epoxy. Removing any paint might show cracks and if so see if there is a pattern that shows the effect of internal pressure. Just a guess.
> 
> Graham Stewart
> Agile. R22, 1976
> Kingston Ontario Canada
> 
> 
> 
> From: C. Robert Lester [mailto:C.Robert.Lester at dartmouth.edu]
> Sent: Saturday, February 11, 2017 11:06 AM
> To: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
> Subject: Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
> 
> 
> 
> I have an 84 Rhodes 22, that came with a "slightly-curved" rudder? As you can imagine, when under power this applies a slight port steer. As interested as I am in what would have caused this slight curve to the rudder, I am more interested in repairing/replacing this issue.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks in advance for your thoughts / suggestions.
> 
> 
> 
> Bob
> 
__________________________________________________
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From peter at sunnybeeches.com  Fri Nov 25 17:26:07 2022
From: peter at sunnybeeches.com (Peter Nyberg)
Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2022 14:26:07 -0800
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
Message-ID: <E1oyh95-004zEk-O7@s152.servername.online>

Bob,

You seem happy with your new rudder, and so I'm happy for you as well, but those two rudders look pretty much the same to me.

--Peter

> On 2022-11-25, at 17:09:29 EST, C. Robert Lester wrote:
>
> I'm the new owner of a rudder off an '82 R22.
> Cannot wait to sail / race next sailing season.
> Took some pics of my '84 Rudder (curved, black/red) and '82 Rudder (white) side 
> by side. 
> The boats are only 2 years apart but the rudder heads as well as the rudders are 
> not similar at all. 
> I was going to buy the '82 stern rail as well but that is even a different mount 
> and size from my '84. 
> Comments, questions?
> 
> Thanks all,
> Bob
> '84 ORION
> 
> 
> 
> 
> <a 
> href="http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20221125/10ad9055/attachment.jpg" 
> target="_blank">Rudder 1a.jpg</a> 
> 
> <a 
> href="http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20221125/10ad9055/attachment-0001.jpg" 
> target="_blank">Rudder 2a.jpg</a> 
> 
> <a 
> href="http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20221125/10ad9055/attachment-0002.jpg" 
> target="_blank">Rudder 3a.jpg</a> 
> 


From roger_pihlaja at msn.com  Fri Nov 25 17:48:10 2022
From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA)
Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2022 22:48:10 +0000
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
In-Reply-To: <E1oyh95-004zEk-O7@s152.servername.online>
References: <E1oyh95-004zEk-O7@s152.servername.online>
Message-ID: <IA1PR10MB6686D9C2454DCB18751E35EC800E9@IA1PR10MB6686.namprd10.prod.outlook.com>

Bob,

I agree with Peter.  If there are any differences between the two rudders, they are not readily apparent in the photos.  Is there any measurable difference in parameters like maximum thickness, chord length from the leading edge to point of maximum thickness, etc?  Is there any asymetery in the curvature of the hydrofoil on each side? Both rudders appear to be straight.  What do you mean by ?curved??

Roger Pihlaja
S/V Dynamic Equilibrium

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 25, 2022, at 5:26 PM, Peter Nyberg <peter at sunnybeeches.com> wrote:
> 
> ?Bob,
> 
> You seem happy with your new rudder, and so I'm happy for you as well, but those two rudders look pretty much the same to me.
> 
> --Peter
> 
>> On 2022-11-25, at 17:09:29 EST, C. Robert Lester wrote:
>> 
>> I'm the new owner of a rudder off an '82 R22.
>> Cannot wait to sail / race next sailing season.
>> Took some pics of my '84 Rudder (curved, black/red) and '82 Rudder (white) side 
>> by side. 
>> The boats are only 2 years apart but the rudder heads as well as the rudders are 
>> not similar at all. 
>> I was going to buy the '82 stern rail as well but that is even a different mount 
>> and size from my '84. 
>> Comments, questions?
>> 
>> Thanks all,
>> Bob
>> '84 ORION
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> <a 
>> href="https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7C%7Cd09861f000784a7cb42808dacf340f30%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638050119754738534%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=2%2FlYlSVnEpTnaNqcJ6KcohYH5Mp6bJicXQXi5es2bCg%3D&amp;reserved=0" 
>> target="_blank">Rudder 1a.jpg</a> 
>> 
>> <a 
>> href="https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment-0001.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7C%7Cd09861f000784a7cb42808dacf340f30%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638050119754738534%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=jb%2FqyXGnRhbl%2B96mT3YAC7z6k%2FGWx16Nu09%2Bv%2BBz3pU%3D&amp;reserved=0" 
>> target="_blank">Rudder 2a.jpg</a> 
>> 
>> <a 
>> href="https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment-0002.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7C%7Cd09861f000784a7cb42808dacf340f30%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638050119754738534%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=1gLAUSJD%2FLJHorQ5gSy79T%2B9EPYD3M5%2Bf6hkidjNvnY%3D&amp;reserved=0" 
>> target="_blank">Rudder 3a.jpg</a> 
>> 
> 

From C.Robert.Lester at dartmouth.edu  Fri Nov 25 19:17:00 2022
From: C.Robert.Lester at dartmouth.edu (C. Robert Lester)
Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2022 00:17:00 +0000
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
In-Reply-To: <E1oyh95-004zEk-O7@s152.servername.online>
References: <E1oyh95-004zEk-O7@s152.servername.online>
Message-ID: <MW5PR03MB6879653D6ED08690D9C08E7BAE119@MW5PR03MB6879.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>

Thanks Peter.
Forgive me for not being able to capture the differences in shape with the first pics.
Here is the original pic that I posted. (Yes, that is snow on the ground when I pulled her at end of season.).
Note:
Tiller handle was placed, centerline.
Rudder head at top you can see bolts & nuts both sides.
Rudder is twisted to port, but curved to Starboard.
I hope this is helpful.
Not the pics yesterday show the "patches" of repair that were exposed by pressure washing off the red and black paint this summer.
Bob
'84 Orion


-----Original Message-----
From: Rhodes22-list <rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org> On Behalf Of Peter Nyberg
Sent: Friday, November 25, 2022 5:26 PM
To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22

Bob,

You seem happy with your new rudder, and so I'm happy for you as well, but those two rudders look pretty much the same to me.

--Peter

> On 2022-11-25, at 17:09:29 EST, C. Robert Lester wrote:
>
> I'm the new owner of a rudder off an '82 R22.
> Cannot wait to sail / race next sailing season.
> Took some pics of my '84 Rudder (curved, black/red) and '82 Rudder 
> (white) side by side.
> The boats are only 2 years apart but the rudder heads as well as the 
> rudders are not similar at all.
> I was going to buy the '82 stern rail as well but that is even a 
> different mount and size from my '84.
> Comments, questions?
> 
> Thanks all,
> Bob
> '84 ORION
> 
> 
> 
> 
> <a
> href="https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7Cc.robert.lester%40dartmouth.edu%7C91e9c5d0f0f848ba822108dacf340ef6%7C995b093648d640e5a31ebf689ec9446f%7C0%7C0%7C638050119769164077%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=jAH1SgjXpqNVYA9DFo%2BOaW51Yru7cRlFl1y%2Fk5WFwDs%3D&amp;reserved=0" 
> target="_blank">Rudder 1a.jpg</a>
> 
> <a
> href="https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment-0001.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7Cc.robert.lester%40dartmouth.edu%7C91e9c5d0f0f848ba822108dacf340ef6%7C995b093648d640e5a31ebf689ec9446f%7C0%7C0%7C638050119769164077%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=bhZbS3G14v5gWsMzgfXiKpbleK6dYLGM5Kfquowb1Kg%3D&amp;reserved=0" 
> target="_blank">Rudder 2a.jpg</a>
> 
> <a
> href="https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment-0002.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7Cc.robert.lester%40dartmouth.edu%7C91e9c5d0f0f848ba822108dacf340ef6%7C995b093648d640e5a31ebf689ec9446f%7C0%7C0%7C638050119769164077%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=vjTwF84WbZig1mFjUzfjKx6C0y9II68CqjER8ceXTfU%3D&amp;reserved=0" 
> target="_blank">Rudder 3a.jpg</a>
> 

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From roger_pihlaja at msn.com  Fri Nov 25 20:33:04 2022
From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA)
Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2022 01:33:04 +0000
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
In-Reply-To: <MW5PR03MB6879653D6ED08690D9C08E7BAE119@MW5PR03MB6879.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>
References: <MW5PR03MB6879653D6ED08690D9C08E7BAE119@MW5PR03MB6879.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <CY8PR10MB6683C62A3443B19A58EF286D80119@CY8PR10MB6683.namprd10.prod.outlook.com>

Hi Bob,

OK, now I see what you mean.  Is that much misalignment noticeable under sail?   Is the tiller position different to go straight ahead on port tack vs starboard tack?

Anyway, I don?t think there is any way to fix that rudder blade.  So, you did the right thing to replace it.

Roger Pihlaja
S/V Dynamic Equilibrium

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 25, 2022, at 7:17 PM, C. Robert Lester <C.Robert.Lester at dartmouth.edu> wrote:
> 
> ?Thanks Peter.
> Forgive me for not being able to capture the differences in shape with the first pics.
> Here is the original pic that I posted. (Yes, that is snow on the ground when I pulled her at end of season.).
> Note:
> Tiller handle was placed, centerline.
> Rudder head at top you can see bolts & nuts both sides.
> Rudder is twisted to port, but curved to Starboard.
> I hope this is helpful.
> Not the pics yesterday show the "patches" of repair that were exposed by pressure washing off the red and black paint this summer.
> Bob
> '84 Orion
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rhodes22-list <rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org> On Behalf Of Peter Nyberg
> Sent: Friday, November 25, 2022 5:26 PM
> To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
> 
> Bob,
> 
> You seem happy with your new rudder, and so I'm happy for you as well, but those two rudders look pretty much the same to me.
> 
> --Peter
> 
>> On 2022-11-25, at 17:09:29 EST, C. Robert Lester wrote:
>> 
>> I'm the new owner of a rudder off an '82 R22.
>> Cannot wait to sail / race next sailing season.
>> Took some pics of my '84 Rudder (curved, black/red) and '82 Rudder 
>> (white) side by side.
>> The boats are only 2 years apart but the rudder heads as well as the 
>> rudders are not similar at all.
>> I was going to buy the '82 stern rail as well but that is even a 
>> different mount and size from my '84.
>> Comments, questions?
>> 
>> Thanks all,
>> Bob
>> '84 ORION
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> <a
>> href="https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7C%7C6842061a985f405d568508dacf438c65%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638050186289569294%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=Bj%2FuuxiOTmtXVBq9xWVlAM%2Ft7fQZEe1XquvD4kCpxSY%3D&amp;reserved=0" 
>> target="_blank">Rudder 1a.jpg</a>
>> 
>> <a
>> href="https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment-0001.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7C%7C6842061a985f405d568508dacf438c65%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638050186289569294%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=Ym9t6mm2ep7QW%2FjW3g%2B3uwKLC9hs%2FuF%2FHiokaVV4clM%3D&amp;reserved=0" 
>> target="_blank">Rudder 2a.jpg</a>
>> 
>> <a
>> href="https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment-0002.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7C%7C6842061a985f405d568508dacf438c65%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638050186289569294%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=b8Kqr2lVDPRIbwMLKmJqzS2dSjJ72GCyvENHNliyXL8%3D&amp;reserved=0" 
>> target="_blank">Rudder 3a.jpg</a>
>> 
> 
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From C.Robert.Lester at dartmouth.edu  Fri Nov 25 21:31:02 2022
From: C.Robert.Lester at dartmouth.edu (C. Robert Lester)
Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2022 02:31:02 +0000
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
In-Reply-To: <CY8PR10MB6683C62A3443B19A58EF286D80119@CY8PR10MB6683.namprd10.prod.outlook.com>
References: <MW5PR03MB6879653D6ED08690D9C08E7BAE119@MW5PR03MB6879.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>
 <CY8PR10MB6683C62A3443B19A58EF286D80119@CY8PR10MB6683.namprd10.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <MW5PR03MB68797A8350BBF4E2EC1480D3AE119@MW5PR03MB6879.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>

Thanks Roger.
Sailing the last 10 yrs of ORION has been favored port tack, with a Catalina 22 rudder tiller.
It will be nice next season to see how this '82 rudder tacks?
Bob
'84 ORION


-----Original Message-----
From: Rhodes22-list <rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org> On Behalf Of ROGER PIHLAJA
Sent: Friday, November 25, 2022 8:33 PM
To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22

Hi Bob,

OK, now I see what you mean.  Is that much misalignment noticeable under sail?   Is the tiller position different to go straight ahead on port tack vs starboard tack?

Anyway, I don?t think there is any way to fix that rudder blade.  So, you did the right thing to replace it.

Roger Pihlaja
S/V Dynamic Equilibrium

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 25, 2022, at 7:17 PM, C. Robert Lester <C.Robert.Lester at dartmouth.edu> wrote:
> 
> ?Thanks Peter.
> Forgive me for not being able to capture the differences in shape with the first pics.
> Here is the original pic that I posted. (Yes, that is snow on the ground when I pulled her at end of season.).
> Note:
> Tiller handle was placed, centerline.
> Rudder head at top you can see bolts & nuts both sides.
> Rudder is twisted to port, but curved to Starboard.
> I hope this is helpful.
> Not the pics yesterday show the "patches" of repair that were exposed by pressure washing off the red and black paint this summer.
> Bob
> '84 Orion
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rhodes22-list <rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org> On Behalf Of 
> Peter Nyberg
> Sent: Friday, November 25, 2022 5:26 PM
> To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
> 
> Bob,
> 
> You seem happy with your new rudder, and so I'm happy for you as well, but those two rudders look pretty much the same to me.
> 
> --Peter
> 
>> On 2022-11-25, at 17:09:29 EST, C. Robert Lester wrote:
>> 
>> I'm the new owner of a rudder off an '82 R22.
>> Cannot wait to sail / race next sailing season.
>> Took some pics of my '84 Rudder (curved, black/red) and '82 Rudder
>> (white) side by side.
>> The boats are only 2 years apart but the rudder heads as well as the 
>> rudders are not similar at all.
>> I was going to buy the '82 stern rail as well but that is even a 
>> different mount and size from my '84.
>> Comments, questions?
>> 
>> Thanks all,
>> Bob
>> '84 ORION
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> <a
>> href="https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7Cc.robert.lester%40dartmouth.edu%7C1dde6b93ce3d4e739c2d08dacf4e2bfa%7C995b093648d640e5a31ebf689ec9446f%7C0%7C0%7C638050231897795227%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=5%2FvGDzW4lyDlY8bxd8C0SnVIagsqenG%2FNl74DWRsU24%3D&amp;reserved=0" 
>> target="_blank">Rudder 1a.jpg</a>
>> 
>> <a
>> href="https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment-0001.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7Cc.robert.lester%40dartmouth.edu%7C1dde6b93ce3d4e739c2d08dacf4e2bfa%7C995b093648d640e5a31ebf689ec9446f%7C0%7C0%7C638050231897795227%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=6%2FVPk0Yz0raPaBiMYAaNVBCs6BuuLQqJ4yaULWKtmH8%3D&amp;reserved=0" 
>> target="_blank">Rudder 2a.jpg</a>
>> 
>> <a
>> href="https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment-0002.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7Cc.robert.lester%40dartmouth.edu%7C1dde6b93ce3d4e739c2d08dacf4e2bfa%7C995b093648d640e5a31ebf689ec9446f%7C0%7C0%7C638050231897795227%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=falg7p83u8J%2FJM8rsVG3WYzN2JmNaPn06t2a0pbB0bA%3D&amp;reserved=0" 
>> target="_blank">Rudder 3a.jpg</a>
>> 
> 
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From jpd9668 at gmail.com  Sat Nov 26 09:03:58 2022
From: jpd9668 at gmail.com (jpd9668)
Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2022 09:03:58 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
In-Reply-To: <IA1PR10MB6686D9C2454DCB18751E35EC800E9@IA1PR10MB6686.namprd10.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <63821cdb.020a0220.9bd25.399c@mx.google.com>

I don't know what definition of curve is, but there is none unless it's in the plane of the surface which is probably the result of the layup of the fibreglass.Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S22 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone
-------- Original message --------From: ROGER PIHLAJA <roger_pihlaja at msn.com> Date: 11/25/22  5:48 PM  (GMT-05:00) To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22 Bob,I agree with Peter.? If there are any differences between the two rudders, they are not readily apparent in the photos.? Is there any measurable difference in parameters like maximum thickness, chord length from the leading edge to point of maximum thickness, etc?? Is there any asymetery in the curvature of the hydrofoil on each side? Both rudders appear to be straight.? What do you mean by ?curved??Roger PihlajaS/V Dynamic EquilibriumSent from my iPhone> On Nov 25, 2022, at 5:26 PM, Peter Nyberg <peter at sunnybeeches.com> wrote:> > ?Bob,> > You seem happy with your new rudder, and so I'm happy for you as well, but those two rudders look pretty much the same to me.> > --Peter> >> On 2022-11-25, at 17:09:29 EST, C. Robert Lester wrote:>> >> I'm the new owner of a rudder off an '82 R22.>> Cannot wait to sail / race next sailing season.>> Took some pics of my '84 Rudder (curved, black/red) and '82 Rudder (white) side >> by side. >> The boats are only 2 years apart but the rudder heads as well as the rudders are >> not similar at all. >> I was going to buy the '82 stern rail as well but that is even a different mount >> and size from my '84. >> Comments, questions?>> >> Thanks all,>> Bob>> '84 ORION>> >> >> >> >> <a >> href="https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7C%7Cd09861f000784a7cb42808dacf340f30%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638050119754738534%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=2%2FlYlSVnEpTnaNqcJ6KcohYH5Mp6bJicXQXi5es2bCg%3D&amp;reserved=0" >> target="_blank">Rudder 1a.jpg</a> >> >> <a >> href="https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment-0001.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7C%7Cd09861f000784a7cb42808dacf340f30%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638050119754738534%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=jb%2FqyXGnRhbl%2B96mT3YAC7z6k%2FGWx16Nu09%2Bv%2BBz3pU%3D&amp;reserved=0" >> target="_blank">Rudder 2a.jpg</a> >> >> <a >> href="https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment-0002.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7C%7Cd09861f000784a7cb42808dacf340f30%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638050119754738534%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=1gLAUSJD%2FLJHorQ5gSy79T%2B9EPYD3M5%2Bf6hkidjNvnY%3D&amp;reserved=0" >> target="_blank">Rudder 3a.jpg</a> >> > 

From jpd9668 at gmail.com  Sat Nov 26 09:10:09 2022
From: jpd9668 at gmail.com (jpd9668)
Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2022 09:10:09 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
In-Reply-To: <MW5PR03MB6879653D6ED08690D9C08E7BAE119@MW5PR03MB6879.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <63821e4f.020a0220.9bd25.39b5@mx.google.com>

Well, that's not good. Its bent! Don't know what would cause that, but I would think that it will affect performance through increased drag. Roger would know better than I.?Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S22 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone
-------- Original message --------From: "C. Robert Lester" <C.Robert.Lester at dartmouth.edu> Date: 11/25/22  7:17 PM  (GMT-05:00) To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22 Thanks Peter.Forgive me for not being able to capture the differences in shape with the first pics.Here is the original pic that I posted. (Yes, that is snow on the ground when I pulled her at end of season.).Note:Tiller handle was placed, centerline.Rudder head at top you can see bolts & nuts both sides.Rudder is twisted to port, but curved to Starboard.I hope this is helpful.Not the pics yesterday show the "patches" of repair that were exposed by pressure washing off the red and black paint this summer.Bob'84 Orion-----Original Message-----From: Rhodes22-list <rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org> On Behalf Of Peter NybergSent: Friday, November 25, 2022 5:26 PMTo: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.orgSubject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22Bob,You seem happy with your new rudder, and so I'm happy for you as well, but those two rudders look pretty much the same to me.--Peter> On 2022-11-25, at 17:09:29 EST, C. Robert Lester wrote:>> I'm the new owner of a rudder off an '82 R22.> Cannot wait to sail / race next sailing season.> Took some pics of my '84 Rudder (curved, black/red) and '82 Rudder > (white) side by side.> The boats are only 2 years apart but the rudder heads as well as the > rudders are not similar at all.> I was going to buy the '82 stern rail as well but that is even a > different mount and size from my '84.> Comments, questions?> > Thanks all,> Bob> '84 ORION> > > > > <a> href="https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7Cc.robert.lester%40dartmouth.edu%7C91e9c5d0f0f848ba822108dacf340ef6%7C995b093648d640e5a31ebf689ec9446f%7C0%7C0%7C638050119769164077%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=jAH1SgjXpqNVYA9DFo%2BOaW51Yru7cRlFl1y%2Fk5WFwDs%3D&amp;reserved=0" > target="_blank">Rudder 1a.jpg</a>> > <a> href="https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment-0001.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7Cc.robert.lester%40dartmouth.edu%7C91e9c5d0f0f848ba822108dacf340ef6%7C995b093648d640e5a31ebf689ec9446f%7C0%7C0%7C638050119769164077%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=bhZbS3G14v5gWsMzgfXiKpbleK6dYLGM5Kfquowb1Kg%3D&amp;reserved=0" > target="_blank">Rudder 2a.jpg</a>> > <a> href="https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment-0002.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7Cc.robert.lester%40dartmouth.edu%7C91e9c5d0f0f848ba822108dacf340ef6%7C995b093648d640e5a31ebf689ec9446f%7C0%7C0%7C638050119769164077%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=vjTwF84WbZig1mFjUzfjKx6C0y9II68CqjER8ceXTfU%3D&amp;reserved=0" > target="_blank">Rudder 3a.jpg</a>> -------------- next part --------------A non-text attachment was scrubbed...Name: Rudder 4a.jpgType: image/jpegSize: 413162 bytesDesc: Rudder 4a.jpgURL: <http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20221126/a02587b5/attachment.jpg>

From jpd9668 at gmail.com  Sat Nov 26 09:13:30 2022
From: jpd9668 at gmail.com (jpd9668)
Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2022 09:13:30 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
In-Reply-To: <MW5PR03MB68797A8350BBF4E2EC1480D3AE119@MW5PR03MB6879.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <63821f0f.020a0220.9bd25.39be@mx.google.com>

?I don't think there's any difference between 82 and 84 or any other year rudders. Don't stigmatize '84 rudders!Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S22 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone
-------- Original message --------From: "C. Robert Lester" <C.Robert.Lester at dartmouth.edu> Date: 11/25/22  9:31 PM  (GMT-05:00) To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22 Thanks Roger.Sailing the last 10 yrs of ORION has been favored port tack, with a Catalina 22 rudder tiller.It will be nice next season to see how this '82 rudder tacks?Bob'84 ORION-----Original Message-----From: Rhodes22-list <rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org> On Behalf Of ROGER PIHLAJASent: Friday, November 25, 2022 8:33 PMTo: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22Hi Bob,OK, now I see what you mean.? Is that much misalignment noticeable under sail??? Is the tiller position different to go straight ahead on port tack vs starboard tack?Anyway, I don?t think there is any way to fix that rudder blade.? So, you did the right thing to replace it.Roger PihlajaS/V Dynamic EquilibriumSent from my iPhone> On Nov 25, 2022, at 7:17 PM, C. Robert Lester <C.Robert.Lester at dartmouth.edu> wrote:> > ?Thanks Peter.> Forgive me for not being able to capture the differences in shape with the first pics.> Here is the original pic that I posted. (Yes, that is snow on the ground when I pulled her at end of season.).> Note:> Tiller handle was placed, centerline.> Rudder head at top you can see bolts & nuts both sides.> Rudder is twisted to port, but curved to Starboard.> I hope this is helpful.> Not the pics yesterday show the "patches" of repair that were exposed by pressure washing off the red and black paint this summer.> Bob> '84 Orion> > > -----Original Message-----> From: Rhodes22-list <rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org> On Behalf Of > Peter Nyberg> Sent: Friday, November 25, 2022 5:26 PM> To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22> > Bob,> > You seem happy with your new rudder, and so I'm happy for you as well, but those two rudders look pretty much the same to me.> > --Peter> >> On 2022-11-25, at 17:09:29 EST, C. Robert Lester wrote:>> >> I'm the new owner of a rudder off an '82 R22.>> Cannot wait to sail / race next sailing season.>> Took some pics of my '84 Rudder (curved, black/red) and '82 Rudder>> (white) side by side.>> The boats are only 2 years apart but the rudder heads as well as the >> rudders are not similar at all.>> I was going to buy the '82 stern rail as well but that is even a >> different mount and size from my '84.>> Comments, questions?>> >> Thanks all,>> Bob>> '84 ORION>> >> >> >> >> <a>> href="https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7Cc.robert.lester%40dartmouth.edu%7C1dde6b93ce3d4e739c2d08dacf4e2bfa%7C995b093648d640e5a31ebf689ec9446f%7C0%7C0%7C638050231897795227%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=5%2FvGDzW4lyDlY8bxd8C0SnVIagsqenG%2FNl74DWRsU24%3D&amp;reserved=0" >> target="_blank">Rudder 1a.jpg</a>>> >> <a>> href="https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment-0001.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7Cc.robert.lester%40dartmouth.edu%7C1dde6b93ce3d4e739c2d08dacf4e2bfa%7C995b093648d640e5a31ebf689ec9446f%7C0%7C0%7C638050231897795227%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=6%2FVPk0Yz0raPaBiMYAaNVBCs6BuuLQqJ4yaULWKtmH8%3D&amp;reserved=0" >> target="_blank">Rudder 2a.jpg</a>>> >> <a>> href="https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221125%2F10ad9055%2Fattachment-0002.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7Cc.robert.lester%40dartmouth.edu%7C1dde6b93ce3d4e739c2d08dacf4e2bfa%7C995b093648d640e5a31ebf689ec9446f%7C0%7C0%7C638050231897795227%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=falg7p83u8J%2FJM8rsVG3WYzN2JmNaPn06t2a0pbB0bA%3D&amp;reserved=0" >> target="_blank">Rudder 3a.jpg</a>>> > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was > scrubbed...> Name: Rudder 4a.jpg> Type: image/jpeg> Size: 413162 bytes> Desc: Rudder 4a.jpg> URL: <https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20221126%2Fa02587b5%2Fattachment.jpg&amp;data=05%7C01%7Cc.robert.lester%40dartmouth.edu%7C1dde6b93ce3d4e739c2d08dacf4e2bfa%7C995b093648d640e5a31ebf689ec9446f%7C0%7C0%7C638050231897795227%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&amp;sdata=%2FfotS3oaMoPJ49l2BJvvTqJIHg7PKELw63aG5D1ORAY%3D&amp;reserved=0>

From cknell at vt.edu  Tue Nov 29 11:37:24 2022
From: cknell at vt.edu (Chris on LBI)
Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2022 11:37:24 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
In-Reply-To: <63821e4f.020a0220.9bd25.39b5@mx.google.com>
References: <63821e4f.020a0220.9bd25.39b5@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <c5674348-daad-0878-9b7e-814b9df175c8@vt.edu>

It is so interesting that to me that this topic just came up. I've been 
thinking about posting some late-season observations about my Rhodes 
that are closely related to this thread.

After years of being frustrated with what I consider to be excessive lee 
helm, toward the end of this past season I noticed that the forward edge 
of my rudder was not vertical. It is much like the white rudder shown in 
Bob's photo. It kicks forward a little. In an attempt to rectify this, I 
changed how I was using the rudder down-haul. Rather than pull it tight, 
I eased off a bit allowing me to use the up-haul to make the leading 
edge of the rudder close to vertical.

I only had the opportunity to try this twice before we had to take the 
boat out for the season, but in both outings, I was able to much more 
easily balance the helm and was able to tack very close to 90 degrees 
(something that eluded me on this boat since we purchased her). Attached 
is a diagram showing my track as I tested my ability to tack while 
sailing as close to the wind as I could. As you can see, the tacks were 
about 95 degrees. In the past I was generally closer to 110 degrees, so 
I consider this a great improvement.

Also, prior to trying this adjustment with the rudder, we frequently had 
difficulty bringing the bow through the wind; we had to be very precise 
with our timing of releasing sheets. I did not have the opportunity to 
test the change in high wind conditions, but she seemed to be much more 
responsive to a turn to windward.

I'll continue to experiment next year and spend more time working on a 
way to be sure that the leading edge of the rudder is truly vertical.

Chris

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From jpd9668 at gmail.com  Tue Nov 29 13:13:33 2022
From: jpd9668 at gmail.com (jpd9668 at gmail.com)
Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2022 13:13:33 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
In-Reply-To: <c5674348-daad-0878-9b7e-814b9df175c8@vt.edu>
References: <63821e4f.020a0220.9bd25.39b5@mx.google.com>
 <c5674348-daad-0878-9b7e-814b9df175c8@vt.edu>
Message-ID: <000201d9041e$513b6fc0$f3b24f40$@gmail.com>

Chris,
Yours is much different than my experience. Until Stan instructed me how to use the downhaul on the rudder, I had severe lee helm. Once I pulled the downhaul tight my helm has been balanced ever since. If you're getting 95 deg. or less on point, that's pretty good. Do you have roller furling jib?

Joe Dempsey
S/V Respite
Deltaville, VA

-----Original Message-----
From: Rhodes22-list <rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org> On Behalf Of Chris on LBI
Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2022 11:37 AM
To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22

It is so interesting that to me that this topic just came up. I've been thinking about posting some late-season observations about my Rhodes that are closely related to this thread.

After years of being frustrated with what I consider to be excessive lee helm, toward the end of this past season I noticed that the forward edge of my rudder was not vertical. It is much like the white rudder shown in Bob's photo. It kicks forward a little. In an attempt to rectify this, I changed how I was using the rudder down-haul. Rather than pull it tight, I eased off a bit allowing me to use the up-haul to make the leading edge of the rudder close to vertical.

I only had the opportunity to try this twice before we had to take the boat out for the season, but in both outings, I was able to much more easily balance the helm and was able to tack very close to 90 degrees (something that eluded me on this boat since we purchased her). Attached is a diagram showing my track as I tested my ability to tack while sailing as close to the wind as I could. As you can see, the tacks were about 95 degrees. In the past I was generally closer to 110 degrees, so I consider this a great improvement.

Also, prior to trying this adjustment with the rudder, we frequently had difficulty bringing the bow through the wind; we had to be very precise with our timing of releasing sheets. I did not have the opportunity to test the change in high wind conditions, but she seemed to be much more responsive to a turn to windward.

I'll continue to experiment next year and spend more time working on a way to be sure that the leading edge of the rudder is truly vertical.

Chris

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From roger_pihlaja at msn.com  Tue Nov 29 14:55:21 2022
From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA)
Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2022 19:55:21 +0000
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
In-Reply-To: <000201d9041e$513b6fc0$f3b24f40$@gmail.com>
References: <63821e4f.020a0220.9bd25.39b5@mx.google.com>
 <c5674348-daad-0878-9b7e-814b9df175c8@vt.edu>
 <000201d9041e$513b6fc0$f3b24f40$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CY8PR10MB6683D4528620D2943A4CEFFF80129@CY8PR10MB6683.namprd10.prod.outlook.com>

Chris,

After reading your post, I went out and looked my boat?s rudder.  On my R-22, the rudder blade pivots until it comes up against the underside of the rudder head.  On my boat, the leading edge of the rudder blade makes a straight line with the leading edge of the rudder head when the rudder blade is all the way down against this positive mechanical stop.  However, there are several manufacturing tolerances that can affect this geometry.  The exact size and shape of the rudder head and rudder blade relative to the location of the rudder blade?s pivot are critical.  If your rudder blade pivots too far forward, probably the easiest way to fix it will be to install a shim in between the bottom of the rudder head and the top of the rudder blade.

I know from experience; that, pivoting the rudder blade up tends to increase weather helm.  But, in my experience, the helm is not that sensitive to this adjustment, especially when the rudder blade is nearly fully down.  How much did you have to move the rudder blade in order to get rid of your lee helm?

By the way, what was your angle of heel when you were doing your tacking angle experiment?  As you may know, the wetted surface area of the R-22 hull becomes very asymmetric as the hull heels over.  The asymmetry tends to produce weather helm, becoming more pronounced as the angle of heel increases.  You may find your boat has lee helm when sailed flat, transitioning to neutral helm, and then weather helm as you heel over.  Before you modify your rudder, be certain you are not introducing heavy weather helm when the boat?s rail is in the water.

Roger Pihlaja
S/V Dynamic Equilibrium

Sent from my iPhone
> On Nov 29, 2022, at 1:13 PM, jpd9668 at gmail.com wrote:
> 
> ?Chris,
> Yours is much different than my experience. Until Stan instructed me how to use the downhaul on the rudder, I had severe lee helm. Once I pulled the downhaul tight my helm has been balanced ever since. If you're getting 95 deg. or less on point, that's pretty good. Do you have roller furling jib?
> 
> Joe Dempsey
> S/V Respite
> Deltaville, VA
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rhodes22-list <rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org> On Behalf Of Chris on LBI
> Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2022 11:37 AM
> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
> 
> It is so interesting that to me that this topic just came up. I've been thinking about posting some late-season observations about my Rhodes that are closely related to this thread.
> 
> After years of being frustrated with what I consider to be excessive lee helm, toward the end of this past season I noticed that the forward edge of my rudder was not vertical. It is much like the white rudder shown in Bob's photo. It kicks forward a little. In an attempt to rectify this, I changed how I was using the rudder down-haul. Rather than pull it tight, I eased off a bit allowing me to use the up-haul to make the leading edge of the rudder close to vertical.
> 
> I only had the opportunity to try this twice before we had to take the boat out for the season, but in both outings, I was able to much more easily balance the helm and was able to tack very close to 90 degrees (something that eluded me on this boat since we purchased her). Attached is a diagram showing my track as I tested my ability to tack while sailing as close to the wind as I could. As you can see, the tacks were about 95 degrees. In the past I was generally closer to 110 degrees, so I consider this a great improvement.
> 
> Also, prior to trying this adjustment with the rudder, we frequently had difficulty bringing the bow through the wind; we had to be very precise with our timing of releasing sheets. I did not have the opportunity to test the change in high wind conditions, but she seemed to be much more responsive to a turn to windward.
> 
> I'll continue to experiment next year and spend more time working on a way to be sure that the leading edge of the rudder is truly vertical.
> 
> Chris
> 
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> 

From cknell at vt.edu  Tue Nov 29 23:25:59 2022
From: cknell at vt.edu (Chris on LBI)
Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2022 23:25:59 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
In-Reply-To: <000201d9041e$513b6fc0$f3b24f40$@gmail.com>
References: <63821e4f.020a0220.9bd25.39b5@mx.google.com>
 <c5674348-daad-0878-9b7e-814b9df175c8@vt.edu>
 <000201d9041e$513b6fc0$f3b24f40$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b482d3ee-6fbb-a590-0f60-6b2eccf7982f@vt.edu>

Joe,
I do have a roller furling jib. On this particular day, when I was 
experimenting, I had my 130 genoa unfurled to the upper shrouds.
Chris

On 11/29/2022 1:13 PM, jpd9668 at gmail.com wrote:
> Chris,
> Yours is much different than my experience. Until Stan instructed me how to use the downhaul on the rudder, I had severe lee helm. Once I pulled the downhaul tight my helm has been balanced ever since. If you're getting 95 deg. or less on point, that's pretty good. Do you have roller furling jib?
>
> Joe Dempsey
> S/V Respite
> Deltaville, VA
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rhodes22-list <rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org> On Behalf Of Chris on LBI
> Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2022 11:37 AM
> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
>
> It is so interesting that to me that this topic just came up. I've been thinking about posting some late-season observations about my Rhodes that are closely related to this thread.
>
> After years of being frustrated with what I consider to be excessive lee helm, toward the end of this past season I noticed that the forward edge of my rudder was not vertical. It is much like the white rudder shown in Bob's photo. It kicks forward a little. In an attempt to rectify this, I changed how I was using the rudder down-haul. Rather than pull it tight, I eased off a bit allowing me to use the up-haul to make the leading edge of the rudder close to vertical.
>
> I only had the opportunity to try this twice before we had to take the boat out for the season, but in both outings, I was able to much more easily balance the helm and was able to tack very close to 90 degrees (something that eluded me on this boat since we purchased her). Attached is a diagram showing my track as I tested my ability to tack while sailing as close to the wind as I could. As you can see, the tacks were about 95 degrees. In the past I was generally closer to 110 degrees, so I consider this a great improvement.
>
> Also, prior to trying this adjustment with the rudder, we frequently had difficulty bringing the bow through the wind; we had to be very precise with our timing of releasing sheets. I did not have the opportunity to test the change in high wind conditions, but she seemed to be much more responsive to a turn to windward.
>
> I'll continue to experiment next year and spend more time working on a way to be sure that the leading edge of the rudder is truly vertical.
>
> Chris
>
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>


From cknell at vt.edu  Wed Nov 30 00:04:49 2022
From: cknell at vt.edu (Chris on LBI)
Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2022 00:04:49 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
In-Reply-To: <CY8PR10MB6683D4528620D2943A4CEFFF80129@CY8PR10MB6683.namprd10.prod.outlook.com>
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Roger,

I don't have a sense for how much I moved the rudder blade on my two 
trials. I was just hoping that some change would be noticeable. I'll pay 
more attention next season, and, next time I have a chance, I'll try to 
measure the difference between the "full down haul" position and the 
vertical position. I'll also look at the mechanical stop to get a sense 
for how a shim might be implemented. But for now, I think just using the 
tension between the down-haul and the up-haul will be best for 
experimenting so that I can convince myself that helm behavior really 
does change.

On the two days that I experimented, I was intentionally keeping the 
heel angle minimal, attempting to keep it flat. The winds were around 10 
kts. I had the 130 genoa unfurled to the upper shrouds. So the luff of 
the headsail was not shaped well due to the sail furled on the headstay.

On many days, we find ourselves sailing in 18 to 20 kts. We tend to be 
timid about heeling too much and generally either fall off to a more 
comfortable (flatter) reach or reduce sail. I've never really 
experienced the transition to weather helm due to heeling - even when we 
are heeled past our comfort angle. We probably head up before heeling 
sufficiently to cause the hull shape to induce weather helm.

Chris



On 11/29/2022 2:55 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote:
> Chris,
>
> After reading your post, I went out and looked my boat?s rudder.  On my R-22, the rudder blade pivots until it comes up against the underside of the rudder head.  On my boat, the leading edge of the rudder blade makes a straight line with the leading edge of the rudder head when the rudder blade is all the way down against this positive mechanical stop.  However, there are several manufacturing tolerances that can affect this geometry.  The exact size and shape of the rudder head and rudder blade relative to the location of the rudder blade?s pivot are critical.  If your rudder blade pivots too far forward, probably the easiest way to fix it will be to install a shim in between the bottom of the rudder head and the top of the rudder blade.
>
> I know from experience; that, pivoting the rudder blade up tends to increase weather helm.  But, in my experience, the helm is not that sensitive to this adjustment, especially when the rudder blade is nearly fully down.  How much did you have to move the rudder blade in order to get rid of your lee helm?
>
> By the way, what was your angle of heel when you were doing your tacking angle experiment?  As you may know, the wetted surface area of the R-22 hull becomes very asymmetric as the hull heels over.  The asymmetry tends to produce weather helm, becoming more pronounced as the angle of heel increases.  You may find your boat has lee helm when sailed flat, transitioning to neutral helm, and then weather helm as you heel over.  Before you modify your rudder, be certain you are not introducing heavy weather helm when the boat?s rail is in the water.
>
> Roger Pihlaja
> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>> On Nov 29, 2022, at 1:13 PM, jpd9668 at gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> ?Chris,
>> Yours is much different than my experience. Until Stan instructed me how to use the downhaul on the rudder, I had severe lee helm. Once I pulled the downhaul tight my helm has been balanced ever since. If you're getting 95 deg. or less on point, that's pretty good. Do you have roller furling jib?
>>
>> Joe Dempsey
>> S/V Respite
>> Deltaville, VA
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Rhodes22-list <rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org> On Behalf Of Chris on LBI
>> Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2022 11:37 AM
>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
>>
>> It is so interesting that to me that this topic just came up. I've been thinking about posting some late-season observations about my Rhodes that are closely related to this thread.
>>
>> After years of being frustrated with what I consider to be excessive lee helm, toward the end of this past season I noticed that the forward edge of my rudder was not vertical. It is much like the white rudder shown in Bob's photo. It kicks forward a little. In an attempt to rectify this, I changed how I was using the rudder down-haul. Rather than pull it tight, I eased off a bit allowing me to use the up-haul to make the leading edge of the rudder close to vertical.
>>
>> I only had the opportunity to try this twice before we had to take the boat out for the season, but in both outings, I was able to much more easily balance the helm and was able to tack very close to 90 degrees (something that eluded me on this boat since we purchased her). Attached is a diagram showing my track as I tested my ability to tack while sailing as close to the wind as I could. As you can see, the tacks were about 95 degrees. In the past I was generally closer to 110 degrees, so I consider this a great improvement.
>>
>> Also, prior to trying this adjustment with the rudder, we frequently had difficulty bringing the bow through the wind; we had to be very precise with our timing of releasing sheets. I did not have the opportunity to test the change in high wind conditions, but she seemed to be much more responsive to a turn to windward.
>>
>> I'll continue to experiment next year and spend more time working on a way to be sure that the leading edge of the rudder is truly vertical.
>>
>> Chris
>>
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From jpd9668 at gmail.com  Wed Nov 30 08:13:30 2022
From: jpd9668 at gmail.com (jpd9668)
Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2022 08:13:30 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
In-Reply-To: <b482d3ee-6fbb-a590-0f60-6b2eccf7982f@vt.edu>
Message-ID: <63875705.020a0220.7c723.105e@mx.google.com>

Chris,I was very un-clear. The 95 degrees i was referring to was from 45+ degrees on either side of the wind. Was that your point of reference as well? I can get 45 degrees on Port tack? but have trouble getting that close on on starboard tack.Joe DempseySent via the Samsung Galaxy S22 5G, an AT&T 5G smartphone
-------- Original message --------From: Chris on LBI <cknell at vt.edu> Date: 11/29/22  11:26 PM  (GMT-05:00) To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22 Joe,I do have a roller furling jib. On this particular day, when I was experimenting, I had my 130 genoa unfurled to the upper shrouds.ChrisOn 11/29/2022 1:13 PM, jpd9668 at gmail.com wrote:> Chris,> Yours is much different than my experience. Until Stan instructed me how to use the downhaul on the rudder, I had severe lee helm. Once I pulled the downhaul tight my helm has been balanced ever since. If you're getting 95 deg. or less on point, that's pretty good. Do you have roller furling jib?>> Joe Dempsey> S/V Respite> Deltaville, VA>> -----Original Message-----> From: Rhodes22-list <rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org> On Behalf Of Chris on LBI> Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2022 11:37 AM> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22>> It is so interesting that to me that this topic just came up. I've been thinking about posting some late-season observations about my Rhodes that are closely related to this thread.>> After years of being frustrated with what I consider to be excessive lee helm, toward the end of this past season I noticed that the forward edge of my rudder was not vertical. It is much like the white rudder shown in Bob's photo. It kicks forward a little. In an attempt to rectify this, I changed how I was using the rudder down-haul. Rather than pull it tight, I eased off a bit allowing me to use the up-haul to make the leading edge of the rudder close to vertical.>> I only had the opportunity to try this twice before we had to take the boat out for the season, but in both outings, I was able to much more easily balance the helm and was able to tack very close to 90 degrees (something that eluded me on this boat since we purchased her). Attached is a diagram showing my track as I tested my ability to tack while sailing as close to the wind as I could. As you can see, the tacks were about 95 degrees. In the past I was generally closer to 110 degrees, so I consider this a great improvement.>> Also, prior to trying this adjustment with the rudder, we frequently had difficulty bringing the bow through the wind; we had to be very precise with our timing of releasing sheets. I did not have the opportunity to test the change in high wind conditions, but she seemed to be much more responsive to a turn to windward.>> I'll continue to experiment next year and spend more time working on a way to be sure that the leading edge of the rudder is truly vertical.>> Chris>> -------------- next part --------------> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...> Name: IMG_4528.PNG> Type: image/png> Size: 460057 bytes> Desc: not available> URL: <http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20221129/2624e7f9/attachment.png>>

From cknell at vt.edu  Wed Nov 30 09:51:19 2022
From: cknell at vt.edu (Chris on LBI)
Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2022 09:51:19 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Curved Rudder | 84 Rhodes 22
In-Reply-To: <63875705.020a0220.7c723.105e@mx.google.com>
References: <63875705.020a0220.7c723.105e@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <6d06f513-d256-ca5d-0877-3e0065372fc7@vt.edu>

Joe,

I'm not sure which tack I do better on. I'll have to try to check next 
season. I'm afraid that it might be difficult for me to know for sure 
since I am always dealing with significant tidal currents that make 
precise measurements like that nearly impossible.

Chris

From lvjkuhn at gmail.com  Wed Nov 30 17:11:30 2022
From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee Kuhn)
Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2022 17:11:30 -0500
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Removing Gas from Fuel Line
Message-ID: <CAPgvAEmLX7eK5u+y+CKO1chXfn-2HMT1WPSNuo40riptahb_fQ@mail.gmail.com>

What's the easiest way to remove gas from the fuel hose?  The hose has a
ball spring valve at both ends.  I was told not to push the valve open with
some type of tool because I could damage the valve.

I disconnected the tank and put it in the lazarette and then reran the hose
into the lazarette and reconnected the hose to the tank which opened the
valve on that end.  I then disconnected the hose from the outboard and
held it up as high as I could (gravity) and squeezed the primer.  The
primer pumps gas in the opposite direction than I wanted but if you squeeze
it hard and slow the gas will eventually drain into the tank.

Seems like there must be a better way.  The gas was ethanol-free with a
stabilizer.  Should I just leave it in the hose and hope I won't have any
problems starting the outboard in the Spring?

Lee
1999 Rhodes22  AT EASE
Claytor Lake, VA

From peter at sunnybeeches.com  Wed Nov 30 17:30:19 2022
From: peter at sunnybeeches.com (Peter Nyberg)
Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2022 14:30:19 -0800
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Removing Gas from Fuel Line
Message-ID: <E1p0Vat-0063j5-BP@s152.servername.online>

Lee,

It never occurred to me to worry about this.  I do empty my boat fuel tanks into a vehicle in the fall, and I do use a stabilizer for all my boat fuel.  But, I don't have a convenient source for ethanol-free fuel, so I use the universal 90/10 mix.  

Long story short, I've never had a problem getting my outboard running in the spring. 

Peter Nyberg
Coventry, CT
s/v Silverheels (1988/2016)

> On 2022-11-30, at 17:11:30 EST, Lee Kuhn wrote:
>
> What's the easiest way to remove gas from the fuel hose?  The hose has a ball 
> spring valve at both ends.  I was told not to push the valve open with some type 
> of tool because I could damage the valve. 
> 
> I disconnected the tank and put it in the lazarette and then reran the hose into 
> the lazarette and reconnected the hose to the tank which opened the valve on 
> that end.  I then disconnected the hose from the outboard and held it up as high 
> as I could (gravity) and squeezed the primer.  The primer pumps gas in the 
> opposite direction than I wanted but if you squeeze it hard and slow the gas 
> will eventually drain into the tank. 
> 
> Seems like there must be a better way.  The gas was ethanol-free with a 
> stabilizer.  Should I just leave it in the hose and hope I won't have any 
> problems starting the outboard in the Spring? 
> 
> Lee
> 1999 Rhodes22  AT EASE
> Claytor Lake, VA
> 


From roger_pihlaja at msn.com  Wed Nov 30 17:34:37 2022
From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA)
Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2022 22:34:37 +0000
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Removing Gas from Fuel Line
In-Reply-To: <CAPgvAEmLX7eK5u+y+CKO1chXfn-2HMT1WPSNuo40riptahb_fQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPgvAEmLX7eK5u+y+CKO1chXfn-2HMT1WPSNuo40riptahb_fQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CY8PR10MB668383056F98D5A9E6BA561880159@CY8PR10MB6683.namprd10.prod.outlook.com>

Lee,

As long as you push on the ball check valve with something soft, like a piece of plastic, you are unlikely to damage it.  I always drain the gas line at the end of the season.

Roger Pihlaja
S/V Dynamic Equilibrium 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 30, 2022, at 5:11 PM, Lee Kuhn <lvjkuhn at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> ?What's the easiest way to remove gas from the fuel hose?  The hose has a
> ball spring valve at both ends.  I was told not to push the valve open with
> some type of tool because I could damage the valve.
> 
> I disconnected the tank and put it in the lazarette and then reran the hose
> into the lazarette and reconnected the hose to the tank which opened the
> valve on that end.  I then disconnected the hose from the outboard and
> held it up as high as I could (gravity) and squeezed the primer.  The
> primer pumps gas in the opposite direction than I wanted but if you squeeze
> it hard and slow the gas will eventually drain into the tank.
> 
> Seems like there must be a better way.  The gas was ethanol-free with a
> stabilizer.  Should I just leave it in the hose and hope I won't have any
> problems starting the outboard in the Spring?
> 
> Lee
> 1999 Rhodes22  AT EASE
> Claytor Lake, VA

From cjlowe at sssnet.com  Wed Nov 30 21:56:55 2022
From: cjlowe at sssnet.com (cjlowe at sssnet.com)
Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2022 21:56:55 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Removing Gas from Fuel Line
In-Reply-To: <CY8PR10MB668383056F98D5A9E6BA561880159@CY8PR10MB6683.namprd10.prod.ou
 tlook.com>
References: <CAPgvAEmLX7eK5u+y+CKO1chXfn-2HMT1WPSNuo40riptahb_fQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CY8PR10MB668383056F98D5A9E6BA561880159@CY8PR10MB6683.namprd10.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <55562.24.140.30.102.1669863415.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com>

>Lee,

  I bought a replacement for my motor connection, and keep on board in
spare parts. End of season, I put the gas tank in the bed of the truck ,
put the spare connector on the end of the hose and stick it in a five
gallon gas can, pump the bulb a couple times and drink a beer.


Jerry Lowe SV Country Rhodes '86











Lee,
>
> As long as you push on the ball check valve with something soft, like a
> piece of plastic, you are unlikely to damage it.  I always drain the gas
> line at the end of the season.
>
> Roger Pihlaja
> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Nov 30, 2022, at 5:11 PM, Lee Kuhn <lvjkuhn at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> ???What's the easiest way to remove gas from the fuel hose?  The hose
>> has a
>> ball spring valve at both ends.  I was told not to push the valve open
>> with
>> some type of tool because I could damage the valve.
>>
>> I disconnected the tank and put it in the lazarette and then reran the
>> hose
>> into the lazarette and reconnected the hose to the tank which opened
>> the
>> valve on that end.  I then disconnected the hose from the outboard and
>> held it up as high as I could (gravity) and squeezed the primer.  The
>> primer pumps gas in the opposite direction than I wanted but if you
>> squeeze
>> it hard and slow the gas will eventually drain into the tank.
>>
>> Seems like there must be a better way.  The gas was ethanol-free with a
>> stabilizer.  Should I just leave it in the hose and hope I won't have
>> any
>> problems starting the outboard in the Spring?
>>
>> Lee
>> 1999 Rhodes22  AT EASE
>> Claytor Lake, VA
>