[Rhodes22-list] Shortening Sail

Thu Aug 7 10:43:08 EDT 2025

Hi Todd,

My OEM standard mainsail had 2 rows of reef points.  The picture shows a fully battened mainsail that I had built for me.

Yes, any sail loft will be able to add as many reef points as you wish.  My 3rd reef was added after I’d had the sail for awhile.  I wanted it for Great Lakes sailing.  For inland lakes, you could probably get away with 2 reefs.  Of course, you would need to add the required hardware on the boom for every reef point you add.  If you have existing reef hardware; then, that determines the location of the reef points on the sail.  You would specify the location of the reefing hardware on the boom to your sailmaker.  If you are adding reef hardware; then, the reef points can be anywhere you want.  I would stay away from batten pockets and don’t put a reef point tack grommet near a sail slide.  My reefs angle up for the sake of luff tension and also to provide a little more head clearance under the boom.  My boom topping lift is rigged to a cam cleat on the clew end of the boom.  If I want to have less leech tension while reefed, I just trim the topping lift.

As far as where to locate the reef points, there are 3 factors in play.  The 1st is sail area.  For this, sail can be treated as a triangle, making the area easy to calculate.  Remember, the wind force goes up as the square of the wind speed.  ie, Doubling the wind speed results in 4X more force and the force is proportional to the sail area.  The second factor is that reefing the sail causes the center of pressure to be lowered, resulting in less heeling moment.  The 3rd factor is the center of pressure also moves forward when the mainsail is reefed.  This results in less weather helm when heeled over.  By reefing the mainsail, you can leave more of the genoa flying, resulting in better sail shape and more boat speed.  Even if you heel over, the helm will remain balanced and you won’t have to use much rudder, resulting in less drag and more boat speed.  It’s also much less tiresome for the helmsman.  The reef point locations in the photo seem to work pretty well.  So, feel free to scale them off the photo.

In the photo, note the curvature in the foot of the sail.  When rigged, this curvature results in a very full ( ie deep draft ) sail shape.  This shape is appropriate for light air.  When the wind speed increases, the sail shape needs to be flattened.  Another reason for the slant in the reef point locations is to remove the deep draft from the belly of the sail.

In the photo, I have a yellow tape measure stretched from the head of the mainsail to the clew.  You can see how much roach the sail has.  Note, this much roach will require a fully battened sail.  Also, this much roach required the static mast tilt to be adjusted such that my mast has almost zero degrees of aft rake angle in order to adjust out the weather helm when the mainsail is fully deployed.  All the extra roach sail area is in the extreme aft part of the mainsail, where it wants to cause weather helm.

Roger Pihlaja
S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
1976. Sanford, MI
Sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 7, 2025, at 9:26 AM, Ric Stott <ric at stottarchitecture.com> wrote:
>
> I have only two reef points on my continental mainsail. The first is bout 18” above the foot, the 2nd about 2 feet higher.
> I have used them both. It is sort of a Jiffy reef system, but ‘jiffy’ is up for definition in this case.
> BTW - I have a spare Continual mast. If anyone wants/needs it, it will be free to pic up.
> BTW-2 I found a guy that will sand blast and reinforce my trailer to last  for awhile, so my search for a new one has concluded.
> Ric
> Dadventure
>
>
>> On Aug 7, 2025, at 9:13 AM, Todd Tavares <tavares0947 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Roger,
>>
>> I also have a standard mainsail. None of my mains have reef points (I have
>> 3). One is a brand new- never used sail without reef points.
>>
>> This may be a stupid, not thought out question, but:
>> If I took or sent the new main to a sail loft to get 2 reef points added,
>> would they know where they will need to be? ...meaning is  distance from
>> the foot up to each of the reef points a mathematical function of sail
>> shape, luff or foot length or total sail area etc?? Or is it just
>> preference?
>>
>> I also noticed from your pictures that the reef points are not parallel to
>> the boom. I'd assume this is to keep the leech tight since you are above
>> any leech line adjustability...but I also remember you saying you purposely
>> had your mainsail made extra roachy. Any input or expert suggestions, (or
>> actual measurements) would be greatly appreciated.
>>
>> Todd T.
>>
>>> On Thu, Aug 7, 2025, 3:00 AM ROGER PIHLAJA <roger_pihlaja at msn.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Paul,
>>>
>>> Enclosed are 3 photos of my boat.  The 1st shows the mainsail laid out on
>>> the ground.  As you can see, I have 3 jiffy reef points.  To use reef
>>> points 2 & 3, I have to remove the lower batten.
>>>
>>>
>>> [cid:c51d757e-0988-4112-95f0-2deaf1e2c252]
>>>
>>> The second picture shows my boat on a light air spinnaker reach.  As you
>>> can see, I fly my triradial spinnaker with a spinnaker furling sock.  You
>>> can see it in the photo all bunched up on top of the sail.  There is also a
>>> spinnaker pole vang.  But, on this light air day, it wasn't necessary to
>>> keep the spinnaker pole level.  As you can see from the nearly calm water,
>>> we are still moving in almost no wind.
>>>
>>> [cid:e2b8eaa0-d8d4-43de-817c-ed360ebda0a3]
>>> The 3rd picture shows some of the details of my foredeck.  My boat is
>>> rigged to fly a triradial spinnaker as well as a cruising spinnaker.  As
>>> you can see, I have a bimini top as well.
>>>
>>> [cid:2f9b051a-685d-4d1d-9127-35332d9ace5f]
>>>
>>> Roger Pihlaja
>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
>>> 1976  Sanford, MI
>>> ________________________________
>>> From: Rhodes22-list <rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org> on behalf of
>>> Paul Rhodes <plrhodes29 at gmail.com>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 6, 2025 11:44 PM
>>> To: The Rhodes Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Shortening Sail
>>>
>>> Hello All,
>>>
>>> I’ve finally gotten our new-to-us 1990 Rhodes 22 out on the water, and it
>>> was a blast!  Two separate days on Lake Murray near Columbia SC, both with
>>> forecasted winds of 8-10, yet very different actual strengths.  First day
>>> out, my elder son and I discovered that “New Mercies” moves very well in
>>> light to moderate air.  Second day out, a friend of his and I discovered
>>> that her full rig is way too much for whatever we had, which I would guess
>>> at 12-15 mph, if the first day’s 8-10 was accurate.  However, the flared
>>> gunwale held firm and we flew!  Our rails are well washed.
>>>
>>> Given that our two sailboats for the last 4 decades were a heavy wooden
>>> 22ft gaff fractional sloop and a 40 ft yawl of a more classic Phil Rhodes
>>> design, I found the Rhodes 22 to be much more responsive both to me and the
>>> weather, for better and for worse.  She’ll make me a better sailor too.
>>> And I have some questions:
>>>
>>> First, I’m curious to know if the sail numbers relate to the order of
>>> construction, as they do in many classes.  “New Mercies” wears #444, and we
>>> don’t have any evidence of a different number or previous name.
>>>
>>> More importantly, when the Commodore comes aboard for a cruise, I’m pretty
>>> confident that she will prefer a more level boat.  For those of you like us
>>> still using a non-furling main, how do you shorten sail?  As we needed to
>>> on our second day, we simply rolled in the jib a bit.  It worked, but was
>>> pretty sloppy. Any thoughts on keeping the jib shaped when it’s partially
>>> furled?  Our jib furler is very simple: just the sail track with a disk on
>>> the bottom that for the most part keeps the furling line off the deck.  Not
>>> sure whether this is what other boats have, but so far it works.
>>>
>>> As for the main, there is a second grommet that could serve as the tack
>>> for a first reef, but no reef points.  However, the fittings on the boom
>>> are only at the ends.  It seems like I could reef to any amount (at least
>>> up to the first batten) by simply taking the boom out of the mast track and
>>> rolling it to take on the sail.  I like the concept - similar to what was
>>> on our yawl.  Yet with the boom detached unlike on the yawl, I could see
>>> that this might become a very lively operation if we didn’t reef early
>>> enough.  Does anyone have experience or thoughts about this?
>>>
>>> Finally, we’re in the market for a Boom Room, Bimini, and boat cover.
>>> I’ve left a few messages and sent a few emails about them with no replies.
>>> It seems likely that we’ll need to have them made.  Does anyone have plans
>>> or patterns we could use?
>>>
>>> Thanks so much.
>>>
>>> Glad to be part of the Rhodie band,
>>> Paul and Nancy Rhodes
>>> S/V New Mercies
>>> Chapin, SC and Savannah, GA
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> -------------- next part --------------
>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
>>> Name: Full Batten Mainsail.JPG
>>> Type: image/jpeg
>>> Size: 2099647 bytes
>>> Desc: Full Batten Mainsail.JPG
>>> URL: <
>>> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20250807/2f025456/attachment.jpe
>>>>
>>> -------------- next part --------------
>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
>>> Name: Rhodes 22 Triradial Spinnaker.jpg
>>> Type: image/jpeg
>>> Size: 144449 bytes
>>> Desc: Rhodes 22 Triradial Spinnaker.jpg
>>> URL: <
>>> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20250807/2f025456/attachment.jpg
>>>>
>>> -------------- next part --------------
>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
>>> Name: Foredeck Labeled.jpg
>>> Type: image/jpeg
>>> Size: 222595 bytes
>>> Desc: Foredeck Labeled.jpg
>>> URL: <
>>> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20250807/2f025456/attachment-0001.jpg
>>>>
>>>
>
> Richard F. Stott, AIA, LEED AP
> ric at stottarchitecture.com
> C- 516-965-3164
>
>
>