[Rhodes22-list] CDI furler

Mon Aug 22 13:41:02 EDT 2005

This spring it took liberal spraying of Sailkote to get the jib up the
track.

David Walker
David Walker Photography
davidwalkerphotography.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Peter Thorn" <pthorn at nc.rr.com>
To: "David Walker" <dwalker at alum.mit.edu>; "The Rhodes 22 mail list"
<rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 11:49 AM
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] CDI furler

> Dave,
>
> I had a similar experience changing headsails with the CDI in a hurricane
> remnant blowing over 20 at the dock.  Too much friction!  When the mast
and
> furler were next down, I soaked the CDI flexible plastic luff, the halyard
> and especially the head turning fitting in Sailkote lubricant.  That
helped
> immensely (and I wouldn't be surprised if the CDI directions called for
it).
> I would imagine there are also better line choices than the cored cover
that
> comes with the CDI, but haven't investigated this yet.
>
> PT
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "David Walker" <david.walker5 at comcast.net>
> To: "Ronald Lipton" <rlipton at earthlink.net>; "The Rhodes 22 mail list"
> <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 10:55 AM
> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Main Sail Speed
>
>
> > Ron,
> >
> > Thanks for the info.  I've been looking at the UPS or equivalent, also
the
> > vertical battens. Does that increase main area much?
> >
> > Also, changing headsails in the CDI furler is highly overated especially
> in
> > high winds.  The internal halyard ( at least mine) has a lot of friction
> > making raising the sail and making off the halyard and tack a fun
> procedure
> > even on the hard let alone on the water.
> >
> > Dave
> > David Walker
> > David Walker Photography
> > davidwalkerphotography.com
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Ronald Lipton" <rlipton at earthlink.net>
> > To: "David Walker" <dwalker at alum.mit.edu>; "The Rhodes 22 mail list"
> > <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 10:52 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Main Sail Speed
> >
> >
> > > David,
> > >
> > >    Your comments are pretty much on the mark.  The 175 does have some
> > > failings, especially in extreme (high or low) winds.  You can do
several
> > > things that will help (and cost money)
> > > - With the CDI furler you can switch to a smaller jib in high winds.
I
> > have
> > > the GB furler so my only choice is to furl and go to the inboard
tracks.
> > > - Several boats have the UPS sail, which is made of light cloth, can
be
> > > furled,
> > > and is carried behind the 175.  I have only used it a few times so
far,
> > but
> > > it is
> > > the clear choice in light winds.
> > > - I replaced my old IMF main with a slightly hurricane damaged
vertical
> > > batten sail
> > >  I bought. I find that the boat is easier to balance with this sail
and
> > the
> > > main has
> > > increased drive.  It makes a real difference.
> > >
> > > Ron
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "David Walker" <david.walker5 at comcast.net>
> > > To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 9:33 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Main Sail Speed
> > >
> > >
> > > > Phyllis,
> > > >
> > > > I've been watching these emails go by but have not had the time to
> > > > respond.
> > > > I sailed my recycled Rhodes for 2 seasons with a traditional main
and
> a
> > > > 135
> > > > genoa, and then traded with stan for an IMF with 175 on a CDI
furler.
> > > > (BTW - my best research at the time - Stan wasn't too much help as
the
> > > > standard masts are old- was that if you switch masts will need to
> > replace
> > > > the standing rigging as the masts are not the same height)
> > > >
> > > > My experience is that the standard main and 135 sailed a little
faster
> > and
> > > > pointed higher.  With the IMF rig most of the power comes from the
big
> > > > genoa
> > > > and the main is basically balancing the sail plan as in the mizzen
of
> a
> > > > ketch or yawl.  I reef the genoa first then reduce the main to keep
> > > > balance.
> > > > My experience is the boat will not sail well at all with just the
main
> > out
> > > > and will not tack.
> > > >
> > > > There are three problems to this:  1) the big genoa does not sheet
in
> > > > close
> > > > enough to point that well.  It is worse when reefed.  2) the big
genoa
> > is
> > > > made of relatively heavy material and does not perform well in light
> > wind
> > > > aft of the beam due to it weight.  3)  When sailing in high winds in
a
> > > > small
> > > > keel boat, it is usual to ease the mainsheet in gusts to keep the
hull
> > on
> > > > its lines.  With the already small main reefed, you don't have much
to
> > > > dump
> > > > and you need to keep a fair amount of jib out for speed.
> > > >
> > > > Is all this bad? No just different.  Would I go back to a standard
> main?
> > > > No.  In fact the IMF has been keeping me from seriously looking for
a
> > boat
> > > > in the 28-30' range.  For my sailing, the absolute ease of sail
> handling
> > > > makes up for a few more tacks going up wind, and when the J24's pass
> me
> > I
> > > > take solace that when they are furling and covering mains and
bagging
> > > > jibs,
> > > > I'll be relaxing in the cockpit or already on the lauch heading for
a
> > > > restaurant.
> > > > David Walker
> > > > S/V Windspept
> > > > Marblehead  MA
> > > >
> > > > David Walker Photography
> > > > davidwalkerphotography.com
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "P&M Beals" <beals at rci.rutgers.edu>
> > > > To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > > Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 8:50 AM
> > > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Main Sail Speed
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >> HI.
> > > >>
> > > >> It's not speed so much that I care about it's getting so I feel my
> > vessel
> > > >> responds well in different conditions.
> > > >>
> > > >> I think I am making progress...I read your post, Bill, from 3/04
with
> > > > Craig
> > > >> Lowe's tip to help me locate it, on tacking, and tacking when
sailing
> > in
> > > >> stronger winds...
> > > >>
> > > >> I also hope to still connect with Jay Friedland for a Sept. sail on
a
> > > >> good
> > > >> strong windy day... without my 10 yr old daughter worried about too
> > much
> > > >> wind, too much heeling, and see if he has any pointers for us...
> > > >>
> > > >> I believe a good part of my issue has to do with adjusting my
sailing
> > > >> technique to this boat...so I am not faulting the boat...or the IMF
> for
> > > > that
> > > >> matter...I grew up sailing a vessel that would come about on a
> > dime...as
> > > > the
> > > >> saying goes...it sailed so close to the wind that other captains on
> > other
> > > >> sailboats could not believe it, and yes, it was fast, very fast,
and
> it
> > > >> could sail with only a breath of wind...a gaff rigged 36
footer...no
> > > > motor.
> > > >>
> > > >> but hey, that was that boat, and now I am enjoying our R-22... I am
> > > >> interested  to just compare sailing with the traditional mainsail
vs.
> > the
> > > >> IMF....that is why the fact that  I have an R-22 traditional
mainsail
> > > >> neighbor now at my anchorage, but he happens to be kind of a
solitary
> > > > soul,
> > > >> and did not extend an offer to have me sail on his boat, is a
little
> > > >> disappointing...
> > > >>
> > > >> The thought has come to me, that with my boat came a slightly worn
> > > >> traditional mainsail...I could buy from Stan a mast for the
> traditional
> > > >> main, keep the IMF...and do some sailing with the traditional
> > > > mainsail...I'm
> > > >> not convinced I should give up the IMF too quickly  here...
> > > >>
> > > >> but buying a mast  probably is not a cheap item either...I am more
> > > >> interested in getting the motor lift to help me get our 9.9  yamaha
4
> > > > stroke
> > > >> easily out of the water...
> > > >>
> > > >> Phyllis
> > > >> Whisper
> > > >> Keyport
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> > From: Bill Effros <bill at effros.com>
> > > >> > Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > >> > Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 17:03:24 -0400
> > > >> > To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > >> > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Main Sail Speed
> > > >> >
> > > >> > Phyllis,
> > > >> >
> > > >> > I still don't know if boats sail measurably faster with
traditional
> > > >> > sails than IMF, but I've been working with my IMF to see how fast
> it
> > > >> > will sail.  Generally I get most of the drive out of the head
sail,
> > and
> > > >> > use the main sail primarily to keep the boat balanced.  Recently
> I've
> > > >> > been sailing with a full main sail and storm sail sized jib to
try
> to
> > > >> > determine the maximum speed I can get out of main sail alone.  To
> > date
> > > >> > the best I have done is 4.2 kts sustained on main sail alone.
> > > >> >
> > > >> > What is the best speed you can get out of just your main sail?
> What
> > is
> > > >> > the best speed people with traditional main sails can get out of
> > their
> > > >> > main sails alone?
> > > >> >
> > > >> > If the traditional people can get significantly higher boat
speeds
> > out
> > > >> > of just their main sails, I think that would answer some of your
> > > > questions.
> > > >> >
> > > >> > Rummy, are you in this game?  Rummy has a battened IMF.  Does he
> get
> > > >> > more boat speed out of his main sail than non-battened IMF
people?
> > > >> >
> > > >> > I do not set my 4.2 kts. as the gold standard, just as the
starting
> > > >> > point.  I would expect to be able to get 5 kts. under the right
> > > >> > conditions, but I doubt that I could get anywhere near 6.25 under
> IMF
> > > >> > main sail alone.
> > > >> >
> > > >> > Bill Effros
> > > >> >
> > > >> > P&M Beals wrote:
> > > >> >
> > > >> >> Hello.  I was just going through email and saw this note...
> > > >> >> sounds great.
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >> May I ask do you have a traditional mainsail or the IMF?
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >> I bought a 1986 last summer with IMF, and I just feel that this
> boat
> > > > will
> > > >> >> sail even better with a traditional mainsail...
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >> I hope you  can give me a reply.
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >> Phyllis Beals
> > > >> >> Whisper
> > > >> >> Keyport, NJ
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >> By the way, where on the Hudson do you sail?
> > > >> >> Haverstraw Bay?
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >> I used to sail out of  Catskill Creek, Catskill on my father's
> gaff
> > > > rigged
> > > >> >> wooden sloop...this smaller fiberglass boat is a new experience
> for
> > > >> >> me,
> > > > but
> > > >> >> I am trying to hang in there with it.
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >> Thanks again.
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>> From: fnuttersny at aol.com
> > > >> >>> Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > >> >>> Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 23:38:28 -0400
> > > >> >>> To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
> > > >> >>> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] on ballanced boat
> > > >> >>>
> > > >> >>> My 73 R22 is bare bones compared to most others on the list.
Two
> > > > batteries
> > > >> >>> located under the companion way and a 9.5 evinrud in the
> lazzarete
> > > > engine
> > > >> >>> well pretty much makes up my boat.  I basically set her up as a
> > very
> > > >> >>> comfortable day sailer. In this configuration the boat is
> slightly
> > > > stern
> > > >> >>> heavy.  I recently replaced the centerboard with a custom
> composit
> > > > airfoil
> > > >> >>> shaped board with no leading and trailing(the board has the
same
> > > >> >>> width
> > > > over
> > > >> >>> its length) edge taper and 25# of bronze makingup the tip of
the
> > > > board -the
> > > >> >>> board dropes quickly-. I have a new rolly-tasker main and a new
> > 150%
> > > > head
> > > >> >>> sail
> > > >> >>> both hanked on..  I have to say that the boat performs
fantastic.
> > In
> > > > 15 to
> > > >> >>> 20
> > > >> >>> mph wind and full sails there is almost no pressure on the
> tiller.
> > > > The boat
> > > >> >>> seams to dig her nose slightly down and the stern comes up.  I
> can
> > > >> >>> set
> > > > the
> > > >> >>> rudder with the tiller tamer and have held my coarse for up to
45
> > > >> >>> min.
> > > > As
> > > >> >>> the
> > > >> >>> wind picks up I usually stand on the rail up by the mast and
hang
> > on
> > > > to  the
> > > >> >>> sta
> > > >> >>> ys and just look down as the boat sails herself falling of
> slightly
> > > > then
> > > >> >>> rounding up a little back an forth never more than a vew
degrees
> > > > either way.
> > > >> >>> This is the first time I have sailed the boat with realy good
> sails
> > > > and
> > > >> >>> centerboard  etc. and the difference is everything I hoped it
> would
> > > > be.  I
> > > >> >>> believe this is a perfect boat for inland waters in my case the
> > > >> >>> Hudson
> > > >> >>> river.
> > > >> >>> I had four adults on board recently in a steady 25 mph wind. We
> sat
> > > > four in
> > > >> >>> a
> > > >> >>> row and the boat sailed at maybe 5deg.  We flew across the
river
> > > > against a
> > > >> >>> flood tide still very little pressure on the rudder and very
very
> > > > close to
> > > >> >>> the
> > > >> >>> wind.  My passengers thought I was brilliant the way I made the
> > boat
> > > > go
> > > >> >>> exactly were I wanted it to go and in quick time .  Thanks to a
> > great
> > > > design
> > > >> >>> and a vew up grades.
> > > >> >>> __________________________________________________
> > > >> >>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > >> >>>
> > > >> >>>
> > > >> >>>
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >> __________________________________________________
> > > >> >> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>
> > > >> > __________________________________________________
> > > >> > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > >> >
> > > >>
> > > >> __________________________________________________
> > > >> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > >
> > > > __________________________________________________
> > > > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > >
> > > __________________________________________________
> > > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
>
> __________________________________________________
> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list