[Rhodes22-list] Bob et al on recycled boats.

Sat Mar 5 10:13:12 EST 2005

To lurkers and prospective buyers:

Anyone who's read the Rhodes List for any period of time &/or looked at the
Rhodes 22 FAQ website knows I am guilty of being totally out of control when
it comes to upgrades on Dynamic Equilibrium, our 1976 Rhodes 22.  Sure, I'm
an engineer, with a lot of tools, good facilities, and many hands-on skills.
But, I'm not fooling myself that all of my craftsmanship and hard work is
ever going to pay off when it comes time to sell the boat.  Remember, a boat
is a luxury toy, not an investment which appreciates in value.  I upgrade my
boat myself because I enjoy the mental challenge of designing stuff for it
that makes it work better, I enjoy working with my hands, I'm very
meticulous and patient, and I enjoy learning new skills.  (That's Mr. Nerd
to you!)  When I purchase some upgrade from Stan, I'm really saying, "Good
job!  I couldn't have engineered or built this any better myself."  But,
remember, I live right on Sanford Lake.  During the summer, my boat is
docked in a slip in my backyard.  So, I don't have a problem with getting
enough time on the water.  If I want to work on something on the boat, I can
either walk out to my boat slip or pull the boat out of the water at my
subdivision's launch ramp just up the road.  In Michigan, we have these long
snowy winters during which to design and build "stuff".  But, even with all
these advantages, building stuff for the boat tends to fall into the
nonprofitable "hobby" category vs. something that could be reliably expected
to increase resale value.

Building boat stuff is time consuming and requires certain skills.
Knowledge and skills are always the most expensive of human capital.  The
spaces where you often have to work tend to be cramped, hot, poorly
ventilated, and there's hardly a flat surface or right angle in sight.
Epoxy and fiberglass are not the most pleasant materials to work with.
These observations are as true in your home workshop as they are in Stan's
workshops at GBI.     If you are like me, with a "hobby" mindset; then,
working on the boat is also a fun activity in and of itself and I pick up
new skills in the process.  But, if you resent the time that working on the
boat subtracts from time spent on the water and you have a sufficiently high
paying career to even be able to consider a boat in the 1st place; then,
before you take on a project boat, consider what your time is worth.  When
you realistically compare what you could recycle a boat for in terms of
your, fairly valued, time and purchased materials vs. the price Stan offers
his recycled boats for; then, GBI's prices begin to look pretty attractive.
Plus, with a recycled boat from GBI, you get a warranty!

Roger Pihlaja
S/V Dynamic Equilibrium

----- Original Message -----
From: "Peter Thorn" <pthorn at nc.rr.com>
To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 8:37 AM
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Bob et al on recycled boats.

> To lurkers and prospective buyers:
>
> Ed is absolutely correct.  The boat business is tough for custom builders
> and there is no free lunch for buyers.  In my case, attempting to
> auto-recycle an old Rhodes to my Champaign tastes, I discovered that the
sum
> of the parts is actually more expensive than a whole good older boat (if
you
> can find one) -- so I decided to bite the bullet and not spend any more
time
> off the water than necessary.  As a renovation and remodeling contractor,
I
> have handy skills and also have employees who can paint and do fine finish
> work -- but the numbers just didn't work for me.  Stan has an efficient
> operation in a low wage part of NC, and still must charge upwards of
$27,000
> for a new boat and $15,000 for a great recycled boat. He delivers value,
> even though to most such toys are out of reach.  Otherwise, Stan's biggest
> problems would not be in production -- they would be sales.
>
> PT
> R22 Raven
> R22 Phoenix
> Chapel Hill, NC
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "ed kroposki" <ekroposki at charter.net>
> To: "'The Rhodes 22 mail list'" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 8:02 AM
> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bob et al on recycled boats.
>
>
> Yes, the price of recycled boats has apparently gone up.  The price
> and availability of replacement parts has changed.  Keep in mind that Stan
> is guarantying certain things in a recycled boat.  Whenever he finds
> something that needs to be replaced, he also finds the cost have gone up.
> Further aggravating him is that he has outlived so many suppliers.  He has
> to spend a lot of time just finding suitable replacement parts.
> When you get a recycled boat, you get serviceable sails.  Each year
> sail prices have gone up.  How much does it cost to replace sheets and
> lines?
> The price and availability of hulls has gone up.  Furthermore, the
> hull usually has extensive rework.  Moreover, purchasers of the recycled
> boats can be overly demanding on Stan.
> Most purchasers of used sailboats do not have the engineering skills
> of Roger or Bob or Todd.  In addition, even those with the skills soon
find
> that they have underestimated the time to do the necessary work, just ask
> Peter Thorn.
> Contrary to statements by most sellers of used sailboats, a used
> sailboat will require substantial additional cash.  Either you pay it to
> Stan or keep reaching deeper in your wallet....
>
> Ed K
> Greenville, SC, USA
> Addendum:  You will not have to put up with this source of diatribe after
> today for a while.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
> [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Linda Burdett
> Sent: Friday, March 04, 2005 11:37 PM
> To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] looking for rhodes 22
>
> Nope!!! evidently they start at 15 and go up!!!! Linda
>
> Herb Parsons <hparsons at parsonsys.com> wrote:Isn't 10-15k in the recycled
> Rhodes range?
>
> >>> lcathy at sbcglobal.net 03/03/05 2:31 PM >>>
> Rob, good point!! Price range about 10-15 thousand. Want it to have the
IMF,
> marine toilet and bimini along with basics that the rhodes usually have. I
> live in MO and would consider meeting half way or......Thanks, Linda
>
> Rob Lowe wrote:Linda,
> Before anyone else jumps in to ask, how about some more information. Price
> range? Location? Other desires? There are a couple available.
>
> Rob Lowe
> S/V Getaway
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Linda Burdett"
> To:
> Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 11:52 AM
> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] looking for rhodes 22
>
>
> > I am new to the list. Stan suggested I post here to find a pre-owned
> rhodes for sale. Information would be great. Thanks, Linda Burdett
> > __________________________________________________
> > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
>
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