[Rhodes22-list] Blame the

[Rik Sandberg]

Thanks Michael,

Good points all.

Maybe someone could explain to me (and this is only ONE instance where 
the mayor and the people running the city of N.O. dropped the ball) how 
it is that when they knew the levees were so likely to be breached, that 
all of their city and school buses ended up under water??

Just who is it that should be better prepared for this situation than 
the people who are living in it?

As far as the strength of the levees go: They were built to withstand 
the worst storm (Camille '69) that they had ever seen there. They had 
been holding back the waters for almost forty years, as designed. 
According to the ACE the breaks were not in the places that were even on 
the list for addition or repair.

Perhaps Bill's hatred of the President clouds his vision of the situation???

Rik

michael meltzer wrote:

>Frankly bill "blinded by the light" comes to mind or
>Target fixation(same thing that cause a fighter pilot
>fly his plan right into the ground). All you see is
>the "Feds", I think it a little broader. 
>
>I have a problem with allot of the players and also
>take the view that people make rationale decisions
>
>1)IIRC this is a coastal city that is 6 feet on
>average below sea level. You notice the original
>French quarter is OK, why did they let house be built
>in the lower zones? cheap land maybe?????
>
>2)When I bought my house, I had to get a sign off on
>the flood maps, people did not know????? Their are
>sign post all over town showing flood stages(west
>port), I am sure the locals know the score.
>
>3)what happen to every local officials? cut and run
>maybe???, I am sure their were least 500-1000 school
>bus in the local area before the storm. No need to
>spend the money????????
>
>4)population conditioned to "just ride it out", like
>last time, ever notice all the cars in the flood?
>
>5)this has been a problem 30 year in the making, where
>were the district, and city official "planing", again
>they knew the score for a somewhat unique local
>problem, move equipment to high ground? preposition
>supplies(at least 72 hours worth)?, buy only high
>water capable vichicals for city use(like we does with
>trash truck for plowing)? A quick reaction group with
>supplies and methods to plug a level break? The flood
>plans are were know, were was the automatics reaction
>from the local side to get their people out, you know
>the plan and supplies? 
>
>6)why did it take the Gerard/ to bring order? maybe
>something about being shot? the local cops looked just
>like crown heights
>
>7)oh, do not forget all state people, both potical and
>full time staff who seemed duct all responsibly. Nice
>living off the government tit? never make a decision
>that could cost you your job? only contract out work? 
>
>
>8)how of the levels did break? 500 feet out of 100 of
>miles? 99.99+% where OK, the repair thing again, their
>are never any kick backs? shirty work?  
>
>9)FEMA looked bad, no too ways.
>
>10)maybe I am crackly in my old age, but the Russian
>system shooting the general and turn to next in
>command "you are next if this is not solved in 24
>hour" was need here.
>
>11)the military has a problem moving, it it supply
>train, logical support, because everything is
>"organic" it take a while to move into position. they
>used the 82 because they come with their own supplies
>in the drop.
>
>12)could it be bill, just maybe, bush saying "he not
>happy" was enough to shake the lead out of some
>burocrats to make a call, take a risk, solve the
>problem, like in keep their job. how many government
>employs are in play, from at least four pairale
>reporting lines(local, city, state, fed)? 10,000,
>100,000, more, I am not sure, how much is "command and
>control" that failed? 
>
>13)So how much of a new asshole are you going to rip
>me :-), I got at least 2 holes now :-) you will slice
>and dice me in writing style. But when you claim I
>wrong, uninformed, misguided or do not understand.
>well that brings me back to the beginning.  "blinded
>by the light"
>
>
>
> I am only getting started in the list, their are
>allot of players here who failed in leadership now and
>over the years.
>
>
>-mjm
>
>PS. ED has the latest decoder ring:-)
>
>
>
>--- Bill Effros <bill at effros.com> wrote:
>
>  
>
>>Wally,
>>
>>The death and destruction unfolding on the Gulf
>>Coast is not an "Act of 
>>God", and I'm going to speak up when anyone tries to
>>shift the 
>>responsibility for this ongoing tragedy from our
>>federal government 
>>either to God or to the victims.
>>
>>The killing damage was not done by the hurricane in
>>New Orleans.  The 
>>center of the hurricane narrowly missed to the East.
>>Gulfport was flattened.
>>
>>The killing damage in New Orleans happened as a
>>result of Federally 
>>built levees, designed to withstand Category 3
>>storms, failing, and 
>>allowing the city to fill with water.  The Federal
>>Government then 
>>failed to understand that a catastrophe far worse
>>than any hurricane was 
>>in the process of unfolding.
>>
>>You may remember the discussion on this list about
>>the Army Corps of 
>>Engineers saying the water was going to be no
>>problem--that as soon as 
>>the level of the lake water fell below the level of
>>the levee, New 
>>Orleans would naturally drain right back out into
>>the lake.  Just don't 
>>plug up the holes.  I said that was stupid then.  Is
>>there anyone today 
>>who wants to argue that it was smart?
>> 
>>The citizens of New Orleans, along with virtually
>>all of their 
>>politicians, begged the federal government to
>>strengthen the levees for 
>>30 years prior to this collapse.  The Federal
>>government actually 
>>reduced the amount of money, and refused to upgrade
>>the levees.
>>
>>This is a political disaster, not a natural
>>disaster, although the Swift 
>>Boat Captains are already out there, trying to
>>rearrange the facts to 
>>fit their politics.
>>
>>More Americans will die as a result of this man made
>>disaster than will 
>>die in Afghanistan, Iraq and 9/11 combined.  I have
>>many friends in New 
>>Orleans who still have not been heard from.  We all
>>hope they just have 
>>been too busy to call any of us who were out, or who
>>got out.
>>
>>When a judge ruled after 10 years that a feeding
>>tube could legally be 
>>pulled out of Terri Schiavo, the entire Republican
>>Political machine 
>>hopped on airplanes, interrupted vacations, passed
>>legislation, and 
>>attempted to "save" that one life.
>>
>>When perhaps 10,000 people in New Orleans were
>>dying, President Bush 
>>never left his ranch except for fund raisers,
>>Congress did not 
>>reconvene, Dick Cheney never left his ranch at all,
>>Condeleeza Rice went 
>>to see "Spamalot", emergency powers were not
>>invoked, FEMA didn't even 
>>know what was going on, and made the problem worse
>>by turning away help 
>>that was offered, saying it was not needed, no one
>>asked for aircraft...
>>
>>And then, Our President told the head of the Federal
>>Agency who he had 
>>appointed to be in charge of Federal Emergency
>>Management "Brownie, 
>>you're doin' a heck of a job!"
>>
>>Wally, I am mad as hell.  I don't think either my
>>politics or my 
>>judgment is clouded.  My friends are dying, and our
>>government is 
>>spending more time trying to cloud your judgment,
>>than it is trying to 
>>address the issues.  If Herb, or Brad, or Ed, or
>>anyone else tries to 
>>shift the responsibility for this tragedy from the
>>government that 
>>actually created it, to the victims who are still
>>literally fighting for 
>>their lives, they're going to hear from me.
>>
>>I think of you as a fair minded person who weighs
>>all sides of issues.  
>>If you are confused on this issue, and think that it
>>is my judgment that 
>>is clouded, then I must address that.  I'm not mad
>>at you.
>>
>>Our President said on national television, 3 days
>>after the levees broke:
>>
>>"I don't think anyone anticipated the breach of the
>>levees."
>>
>>That is catastrophic, tragic, stupidity.  It is
>>obviously not true on 
>>the face of it.  It is the mark of a government that
>>takes no 
>>responsibility for any failed policy or action.
>>
>>MY judgment is clouded by my politics?  I don't
>>think so.
>>
>>Bill Effros
>>
>>
>>Wally Buck wrote:
>>
>>    
>>
>>>Bill,
>>>
>>>Often I agree with you, sometimes I don't. Your
>>>      
>>>
>>politics are clouding 
>>    
>>
>>>your judgement. This is a Natural Disaster. Try to
>>>      
>>>
>>keep that in mind. 
>>    
>>
>>>This is not the man trying to keep the poor down.
>>>      
>>>
>>Barbara Bush's 
>>    
>>
>>>comment could be misread by those trying to do so.
>>>      
>>>
>>My take; she was 
>>    
>>
>>>commenting that for many they are trying to look
>>>      
>>>
>>at the bright side. 
>>    
>>
>>>They were coming from a less than ideal situation
>>>      
>>>
>>and were hopeful the 
>>    
>>
>>>change might help them. It looked to me like she
>>>      
>>>
>>was trying tio help.
>>    
>>
>>>It does seem the the guy running FEMA was in no
>>>      
>>>
>>way qualified for his 
>>    
>>
>>>job.
>>>
>>>Wally
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>From: Bill Effros <bill at effros.com>
>>>>Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
>>>>        
>>>>
>><rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>    
>>
>>>>To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
>>>>        
>>>>
>><rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>    
>>
>>>>Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Blame the Victims
>>>>Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2005 12:04:54 -0400
>>>>
>>>>Wally,
>>>>
>>>>The campaign to blame the victims is ramping up. 
>>>>        
>>>>
>>Especially if the 
>>    
>>
>>>>victims are poor and black.  The nearby
>>>>        
>>>>
>>predominantly white city of 
>>    
>>
>>>>Chalmette was also wiped out.  Gulfport's
>>>>        
>>>>
>>evacuation plan didn't 
>>    
>>
>>>>work, either.  Biloxi's didn't work.  (For that
>>>>        
>>>>
>>matter, the Key West 
>>    
>>
>>>>Evacuation plan never works, and just remains a
>>>>        
>>>>
>>bad joke.)  St. 
>>    
>>
>>>>Bernard Parish still hasn't received any Federal
>>>>        
>>>>
>>help:
>>    
>>
>>>>"This is Day 8, guys. Everything was diverted
>>>>        
>>>>
>>first to New Orleans, 
>>    
>>
>>>>we understand that. But do you realize we got 18
>>>>        
>>>>
>>to 20 feet of water 
>>    
>>
>>>>from the storm, and we've still got 7 to 8 feet
>>>>        
>>>>
>>of water?" said Ron 
>>    
>>
>>>>Silva, a district fire chief. "If you had dropped
>>>>        
>>>>
>>a bomb on this 
>>    
>>
>>>>place, it couldn't be any worse than this."
>>>>
>>>>"Aaron Broussard, president of Jefferson Parish
>>>>        
>>>>
>>near New Orleans 
>>    
>>
>>>>sobbing, told of an emergency management official
>>>>        
>>>>
>>receiving phone 
>>    
>>
>>>>calls from his mother, who, trapped in a nursing
>>>>        
>>>>
>>home, pleaded day 
>>    
>>
>>>>after day for rescue. Assured by federal
>>>>        
>>>>
>>officials, the man promised 
>>    
>>
>>>>her repeatedly that help was on the way.
>>>>
>>>>"Every day she called him and said, "Are you
>>>>        
>>>>
>>coming, son? Is somebody 
>>    
>>
>>>>coming?' " Mr. Broussard said. "And he said,
>>>>        
>>>>
>>'Yeah, Mama, somebody's 
>>    
>>
>>>>coming to get you.' Somebody's coming to get you
>>>>        
>>>>
>>on 
>>    
>>
>=== message truncated ===
>
>
>
>	
>		
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