[Rhodes22-list] political philosophy- "moral equivalence" (There is no fundamental right or wrong?)

[Ben Cittadino]

Herb;

Come on now. I'm perfectly happy to have an argument with you, but you can't
be dishonest about the subject and expect people to listen.  The evil we
were both talking about had nothing to do with laying people off in the
abstract. It had to do with the POINT of the JOKE which as you very well
know was laying people off BECAUSE THEY HAD OBAMA BUMPER STICKERS. That's
what made it funny to you and offensive to me. "They wanted change and I
gave it to them". Remember? 

Apparently I have somehow managed to hurt your feelings, because is is
usually not your style to use vulgar expressions, except when you are
feeling attacked, so I must have provoked you in some way to cause your "do
you really believe the **** you write?" line. I do think we ought not to use
such profanity on this list and would request that you not do so. Remember,
you and I are not the only people who see this stuff.

In fact, my posts do reflect my beliefs, and for those who wonder why I
waste my time with you, it is because your beliefs reflect those of a
(thankfully small) number of people I have met and dealt with in my life. In
short, understanding the likes of you helps me. Thanks for your contribution
to my education on human nature.

Be well, Herb. Have a truly joyous Holiday Season. I think we're done here.

Ben C.

  

 

hparsons wrote:
> 
> Sorry Ben, you are under a misconception.
> 
> There IS no "evil" in laying off workers. You may choose to call it 
> "throwing workers out in the street', but the truth of the matter is it 
> is a person (or a group of people) choosing to no longer employ an 
> individual, and that is their RIGHT. It's not an evil, it's not even 
> wrong, unless they are doing something contrary to what they've promised.
> 
> If they've signed a contract, they should honor it. If they've made 
> promises, they should honor those. But workers leave (often without 
> notice), simply because they find something  better, decide not to work 
> anymore, whatever. Employers have that same right.
> 
> As for the rest of your drivel, you completely mis read what I wrote. 
> Might I suggest you go back and look at what I actually said:
> 
> "... is not only wrong, but worthy of disdain ..." Is a clue, but 
> frankly, I think you're clueless. You see what you want to see, and 
> anyone that doesn't see it is wrong.
> 
> And what in the WORLD are you talking about "covering for each other". I 
> said nothing in support of Ed, nor did I speak of Marxism.
> 
> Do you REALLY believe the shit you write?
> 
> Ben Cittadino wrote:
>> Ed and Herb;
>>
>> Herb said,
>> "You know something Ben, that you totally miss - EVERYONE thinks their 
>> cause is worthy, and EVERYONE thinks those causes 180 degrees opposite 
>> are wrong. 
>>
>> The difference between you, and others of your ilk, is the arrogance 
>> that says "Not only is my cause the worthy one, but anyone that sees 
>> things differently is not only wrong, but worthy of disdain, because I 
>> am so obviously right that anyone that differs that strongly from me is 
>> unAmerican and wrong." 
>>
>>
>> Ed said,
>> "Your  thought of arrogance is correct.  Arrogance is especially
>> noticeable 
>> in 
>> those who have loss touch with ordinary people.  Arrogance is often 
>> evident 
>> in those of self appointed elites, many of higher formal  education." 
>>
>> So let me get this straight. A strong opinion as to the fundamental
>> "rightness" of one's position on an issue (such as the evil of throwing
>> workers into the street and out of their jobs, joking or not), equates
>> with
>> "arrogance". That is exactly what you both have said . So since EVERYONE
>> feels that way (that their cause is right and the other guy's is wrong) I
>> assume there must not be any absolute Right or Wrong according to your
>> philosophical outlook. Therefor, in your view, all morality is relative
>> only
>> to the person making the judgment. Thus MY morality (fairness to workers
>> and
>> disapproval of jokes celebrating the hurting of workers) represents
>> arrogance to you Herb and you Ed. My recollection is that both of you
>> claim
>> to hold Christian values. Does this mean that your strong opinions on,
>> say,
>> abortion or stem cell research are arrogant? If there is no fundamental
>> Right or Wrong how are we to make judgments? I would offer that some
>> things
>> are Right and some things are Wrong, and that there are Good guys and Bad
>> guys, and the difficulty of confronting evil does not excuse us from the
>> duty to do so. So yes, I believe Bill's joke of several weeks ago was a
>> manifestation of a depraved heart, and was not the least bit funny. And
>> yes,I think the two of you ought to give more thought to what it means to
>> be
>> an American and less to the marxists hiding under your beds. I won't hold
>> my
>> breath waiting for you to engage in any self examination however. You're
>> too
>> busy covering for each other to think for yourselves.
>>
>> Merry Christmas 
>>
>> Ben C. 
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Tootle wrote:
>>   
>>> Rummy,
>>>
>>> Somebody that comes on once every 3 or 4 months ought to consider making
>>> sure others can clearly i.d. who is making the comments.  I do not have
>>> your infallible memory.  However, I do remember various trolls in the
>>> past.  
>>>
>>> Herb,
>>>
>>> Study these web sites:
>>>
>>> http://www.facesoflawsuitabuse.org/facts/
>>>
>>> http://www.instituteforlegalreform.org/
>>>
>>> It is important to remember that one aspect of Marxism is control of the
>>> people.  Remember that Marxism seeks to create a 'Dictatorship of the
>>> Proletariat’.  An important aspect of control is control descent and
>>> free
>>> thought.  An element of dictatorship is for the dictator making his
>>> opinions the correct and only view.  
>>>
>>> A Marxist dictator will claim that he is speaking for the little guy. 
>>> There is glossing over the fact that the little guy can speak for
>>> himself. 
>>> He pretends the little guy incapable of self defense when in fact that
>>> is
>>> not true.  He believes only the Marxist knows the truth.
>>>
>>> Your thought of arrogance is correct.  Arrogance is especially
>>> noticeable
>>> in those who have loss touch with ordinary people.  Arrogance is often
>>> evident in those of self appointed elites, many of higher formal
>>> education.  
>>>
>>> I recall pictures and news reports of a ceremony in the Roman Catholic
>>> Church in Rome where the Pope washes the feet of a group of Cardinals. 
>>> What is the purpose of that ceremony?
>>>
>>> In 1936 Major General J. F. C. Fuller wrote a booklet for the U. S. Army
>>> entitled, Generalship:  Its diseases and Their Cure.  Therein he
>>> discussed
>>> the arrogance of power and one of its cause as disassociation from
>>> reality.  This affliction is evident in the U. S. national media and its
>>> acolytes and some members of this forum.
>>>
>>> Ed K
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>     
>>
>>   
> 
> -- 
> Herb Parsons
> 
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