[Rhodes22-list] therapeutic reply to Todd that the rest of ou can skip

[Todd Tavares]

 I will take your points one by one, but if you re-read all of my posts from December, you will see that my positions were clearly stated,
and then immediately misinterpreted...as usual.


(1)
>>>>

In your e-mail of 12/29/09 you say I said that, "membership to this list be 
conditional upon agreement to giving GB a 5% commission".  I do not recall ever 
saying this.  If you can show me that quote I will apologize to the List.  If 
you cannot, I would expect your apology to the List for putting words in my 
mouth.<<<<<

 In one post I DID apologize for paraphrasing your statements and included an excerpt of one of your previous posts to the List.
See:   http://www.rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/2009-December/063790.html


 
I apologized for paraphrasing but the interpretation of your words was spot on. I said I was sorry but you never that acknowledged
I was accurate.   Your words again posted below. I believe I am owed the apology now and thank you in advance.

"...Why can't the List have such a button that must
be clicked for entry where the fine print says that, in recognition of the
ongoing effort in time and labor and dollars that go into making resale of the
Rhodes easier and higher priced than the competition, Rhodes owners agree to a
modified 5% brokers fee to be paid when and if they sell their Rhodes..."








(2)


>>>>>

In other e-mails inserting yourself in the fray, you posted that it is Art who 
is being (your words) "vilified and berated".  Come on straight shooter,  you 
know the fact is it is GB who is being harassed by Art not following the rule of 
law and breaking agreements and that it is GB who presented a proposal of 
resolution that, as far as I know, Art has ignored.   Until this matter is 
equitably resolved it will keep coming up.  And, until resolved, GB's response 
to calls of help from GB, will be per George Bush's, "You are either with us or 
against us" - we feel that betrayed.<<<<<
To this I can only respond that I am not against you.  This is obviously a serious business dispute,  I was only defending Art's
right to post freely without harassment and not his rights to manufacture any products..  If commercial posts are accepted from
one, then they are accepted from all.
See:  http://www.rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/2009-December/063752.html
http://www.rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/2009-December/063787.html
http://www.rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/2009-December/063762.html
and
http://www.rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/2009-December/063823.html

(3)

>>>>>

We will not bring you in (unless you ask) to any future give and take on the 
issues of GB's value to re-sales or the List's well being;.   We know that in 
your humble opinion the GB position is "insane" and that in GB's humble opinion 
GB's contributions to the demand and price level of re-sales and the List's 
growth and longevity, are priceless - that something like the 5% 
"loyalty/royalty" notion is a mad bargain.   Of course the fact that you and I 
are at the productive end of these 2 issues does not mean I will not enjoy 
further debate with anyone else who is still not clear on the arguments or even 
the analogies like the "Shakers", now that I am adopting my new hero's position 
on basic survival conflicts of  "Bring it on".<<<<<<
    There is no doubt that you manufacture a great boat.....absolutely and without debate the best trailerable sailboat in current 
OR past production. Rhodes 22's hold their value because of their quality and uniqueness, and also because of your personal approach
to selling sailboats.

    While afraid to admit it publicly, private e-mails tell me that many share my ideas that GB does not deserve a 5% 
commission if any owner decides to sell his boat here on the List (unassisted by GB as broker of course). This idea IS completely insane, because it is apples and oranges.  I will explain why I say this.
One of your past posts spoke of burdens taken on by GB to promote private sales. If you act as a broker for a private sale, you should be paid.
Looky loos and low ballers aside, a link to the List on your website or directing phone callers to the List is your only claim to actual hands-on involvement in this type of  private to private sale. If that is worthy of a sales commission, then what is Google's cut?   

    You likened your concept to a real estate broker selling the same house over and over to new buyers and getting paid the sales commission each time. 
Real estate agents--using your example--are licensed sales agents. They act as legal advisors and represent buyers and/or sellers in a transaction, A sellers agent advertises, lists, and shows the property. Agents handle the paperwork, coordinate inspections, ensure the title is researched, field offers, review or draw up the contract, arrange meetings, review credit worthiness, act as negotiators, confer with escrow companies, coordinate the closing, oversee the signing of documents
and disbursement of funds, etc., etc., etc.,    If you want to get this involved in these private to private sales on the List and handle advertising, inspections, negotiate sales prices, draw up contracts, coordinate transportation, handle registration of boats and trailers, etc.,etc.,etc., I will change my description from insane to amazing and even recommend a 7% commission.

This commission idea; because of its insanity I'll argue, evolved into a Loyalty/Royalty fee.  Still a vague concept, but at my last reading and understanding of your latest proposal, a certificate is issued at the first resale of a Rhodes 22 -private to private- with a 5% fee going back to GB.  The certificate ensures GB will support their product--outside of warranty issues-- with parts, responses to calls, letters and e-mails etc.. One can only assume that without this numbered certificate, no support will be given. Please correct me if I am wrong. If this is in fact the case, you will open the door for after market parts producers like IDA Sailor and Art. (don't make me research US Code and pending acts of Congress)

While still not perfect, NOR WHOLLY REJECTED BY ME, the "Certificate of Support" program would be more acceptable if that certificate is transferable to all future buyers or even for a certain number of years after the second resale.  (just a thought and IMHO)

This is probably my third -- and last explanation -- of my past statements, positions and ideas. Research the archives if still unclear.
Please feel free to misinterpret, misconstrue, exaggerate, pervert, slant, mistranslate, overthink, take out of context, adulterate, take personally, or otherwise twist my words to strengthen your own bias or make me out to be the anti-stan.

Todd T.

(As always: For entertainment purposes only....and please no flames from real estate agents, lawyers or rodeo clowns)

Sprocket out!

 

-----Original Message-----
From: stan <stan at rhodes22.com>
To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Sent: Sun, Feb 14, 2010 5:19 pm
Subject: [Rhodes22-list] therapeutic reply to Todd that the rest of ou can skip


Dear Todd,

In your e-mail of 1/20/10 you say, "don't bring me into this",  "don't put words 
in my mouth" and sign "straight shooter".   So I know you will allow me the 
sport, fun and right of follow up, checking how on or off target you may be:

"don't bring me into this".   Too late  You already brought yourself into our 
holistic issues with your prior e-mails.

In your e-mail of 12/29/09 you say I said that, "membership to this list be 
conditional upon agreement to giving GB a 5% commission".  I do not recall ever 
saying this.  If you can show me that quote I will apologize to the List.  If 
you cannot, I would expect your apology to the List for putting words in my 
mouth. 


In other e-mails inserting yourself in the fray, you posted that it is Art who 
is being (your words) "vilified and berated".  Come on straight shooter,  you 
know the fact is it is GB who is being harassed by Art not following the rule of 
law and breaking agreements and that it is GB who presented a proposal of 
resolution that, as far as I know, Art has ignored.   Until this matter is 
equitably resolved it will keep coming up.  And, until resolved, GB's response 
to calls of help from GB, will be per George Bush's, "You are either with us or 
against us" - we feel that betrayed.



We will not bring you in (unless you ask) to any future give and take on the 
issues of GB's value to re-sales or the List's well being;.   We know that in 
your humble opinion the GB position is "insane" and that in GB's humble opinion 
GB's contributions to the demand and price level of re-sales and the List's 
growth and longevity, are priceless - that something like the 5% 
"loyalty/royalty" notion is a mad bargain.   Of course the fact that you and I 
are at the productive end of these 2 issues does not mean I will not enjoy 
further debate with anyone else who is still not clear on the arguments or even 
the analogies like the "Shakers", now that I am adopting my new hero's position 
on basic survival conflicts of  "Bring it on".  

stan/gbi
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