[Rhodes22-list] Rhodes22-list Digest, Vol 2960, Issue 1

David Bradley dwbrad at gmail.com
Fri Aug 24 15:08:08 EDT 2012 

I think the point of the thread was to use them while at a mooring, not for use during sailing. What's pathetic is seeing your boat tied to its mooring laying on its side at in 6 feet of water with the mast stuck to the bottom. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 24, 2012, at 2:42 PM, Ejor2 <ejor2 at aol.com> wrote:

> Rummy,
> 
> I agree 100 percent!! Having sailed/raced many dinghies, primarily lasers, you are not sailing if you don't lay the boat over! The only excuse I could see for these on a dinghy is if you are learning to launch/retrieve on a beach. The force of the breaking waves would probably be too much for it to help anyway. 
> 
> I am not discounting the possible use as we are discussing, but they are made for dinghies and that's pathetic!
> 
> Eric J
> Another on the extreme Rhodes sailing team!
> 
> 
> 
> On Aug 24, 2012, at 12:49 PM, R22RumRunner at aol.com wrote:
> 
>> Having previously owned and sailed a Hobie 16 for many years, I can tell  
>> you with some certainty that no skipper would want one of those floats on the 
>> top of his mast. It screams......ASSHOLE ALERT. Look at me. I can't sail 
>> so I  have a safety float on the top of my mast. If you really need a life 
>> jacket for  your mast, it's time to sell your boat and purchase a recliner and 
>> watch sailing  on your TV. Sailing is not for the feeble minded or weak of 
>> heart. It is  dangerous, but we accept those challenges every single time we 
>> go out.
>> 
>> Rummy
>> 
>> 
>> In a message dated 8/24/2012 8:27:13 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
>> spreadgoodnews at gmail.com writes:
>> 
>> 
>> I  would think by the time it deployed it would already be stuck in the 
>> mud, but  maybe.  The hobie mast head is designed to minimize windage.  Plus i  
>> have always thought they were cool!
>> I have NEVER seen a masthead float on a  cruiser.
>> Others might think you to be an extreme racer! Lol!
>> 
>> 
>> On  Aug 24, 2012, at 1:53 AM, "Chris Geankoplis" <napoli68 at charter.net>  
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> I wonder if there is an auto inflate device out there that  would inflate
>>> when the mast is submerged a couple of feet.  It  would mean less windage
>>> than the big ball on an old Hobie  mast.
>>> 
>>> Chris G
>>> 
>>> -----Original  Message-----
>>> From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
>>> [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of David Bradley
>>> Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2012 8:21 PM
>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email  List
>>> Cc: The Rhodes 22 Email List
>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list]  Rhodes22-list Digest, Vol 2960, Issue 1
>>> 
>>> I'd think the  combination of centerboard down and water shallow enough to
>>> put  mast/spreader in the mud would introduce a different and potentially
>>> bigger problem. 
>>> 
>>> A float on the mast head would be an  interesting option and might have 
>> freed
>>> mine.  Does anyone know,  is that a standard item?  When I took my mast 
>> down
>>> yesterday the  mast head was still full of dried mud. I'm surprised my
>>> spreader was  not bent. 
>>> 
>>> It does seem that the flared hull, freeboard and  cabin profile combine to
>>> create a tendency to roll in a lateral  wind.  The extreme weather 
>> patterns
>>> this year have created more  cyclonic winds on the East Coast than I ever
>>> recall experiencing.  However, there were a number of other boats that 
>> went
>>> over in the  storm that hit us. One estimate was that 30 boats went over,
>>> most  self-righting. Because our boat can be moored in shallower water,
>>> usually a benefit, it worked against us this time with the storm hitting 
>> at
>>> low tide. 
>>> 
>>> Dave
>>> 
>>> On Aug 23, 2012,  at 10:35 PM, Goodness <spreadgoodnews at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> This is a very interesting set of observations!  It seems  the Rhodes 
>> has a
>>> weakness being lightly ballasted and an unusual wind  scoop (but otherwise
>>> beneficial) hull flare.  Sudden gust heeling  the vessel 90+ degrees 
>> buried
>>> mast In shallow water.  This is a  big problem.
>>>> Preventative measures:
>>>> Leave centerboard  down,
>>>> Increase ballast,
>>>> Fly an "anchor rider"  sail,
>>>> Add a hobie masthead float.
>>>> 
>>>> Perhaps  even a combination.  Any other ideas for prevention on a  
>> mooring?
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Aug 23, 2012,  at 12:35 PM, Richard MacArthur
>>> <Richard at MacArthurLawFirm.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> What's going on? I thought my Rhodes 22  was self righting. Self 
>> righting
>>> means that in even the strongest wind  it will blow over 90 degrees but 
>> not
>>> roll. It's supposed to stay at 90  degrees until the wind lets up and then
>>> right itself. A couple of  weeks ago I was caught in a front moving in 
>> and it
>>> blew about 35  knots. I let all sail free and with that I was heeling at
>>> about 45  degrees. It didn't go down all the way and as soon as I got the
>>> sail  in, no problem. It seems that when the flare of the hull digs in the
>>> boat stiffens up. What happens to make it roll? The only thing I can  
>> think
>>> of  is if the vessel is held by the wind with the mast in  the water so 
>> that
>>> water can somehow enter the cabin then it loses its  stability and has 
>> only
>>> the flotation to keep it from sinking and this  would allow it to turn
>>> turtle. I know some catamarans use a flotation  device at the top of the 
>> mast
>>> to stop the mast going to the bottom but  the weight in the keel is 
>> supposed
>>> to do that in a sel!
>>> f!
>>>> r!
>>>>> ighting vessel, unless the interior fills  with water. Am I right on 
>> this?
>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From:  rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
>>> [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of
>>> rhodes22-list-request at rhodes22.org
>>>>> Sent: Thursday, August 23,  2012 12:01 PM
>>>>> To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
>>>>> Subject: Rhodes22-list Digest, Vol 2960, Issue 1
>>>>> 
>>>>> Send Rhodes22-list mailing list submissions  to
>>>>> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
>>>>> 
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>>>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/mailman/listinfo/rhodes22-list
>>>>> or, via  email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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>>>>> 
>>>>> You can  reach the person managing the list at
>>>>> rhodes22-list-owner at rhodes22.org
>>>>> 
>>>>> When  replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>>>>> than "Re: Contents of Rhodes22-list digest..."
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Today's Topics:
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1. Re: Advise me (Joe Camp)
>>>>> 2. Re: Advise me  (Joe Camp)
>>>>> 3. Re: It's national rum month. (Charles  Nieman)
>>>>> 4. Re: Advise me (Lowe, Rob)
>>>>> 5. Re:  Advise me (Stephen Staum)
>>>>> 6. Re: Advise me (David  Bradley)
>>>>> 7. Re: It's national rum month. (Shawn  Boles)
>>>>> 8. Major Jones (Chris Geankoplis)
>>>>> 9.  Re: Advise me (Chris Geankoplis)
>>>>> 10. Re: Advise me (Chris  Geankoplis)
>>>>> 11. Anchor light housing replacement (Patrick  Fletcher)
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>> 
>>>>> Message: 1
>>>>> Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2012 09:02:43  -0700 (PDT)
>>>>> From: Joe Camp  <jjcampjr at yahoo.com>
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Advise  me
>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List  <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>> <1345651363.78003.YahooMailNeo at web130202.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>>>>> 
>>>>> Mary Lou:
>>>>> 
>>>>> ? ? ?I think you really have the  solution here in considering the 
>> flared
>>> hull as a potential (or the  most likely)
>>>>> reason for these roll-overs... or mine,  anyway.
>>>>> 
>>>>> ? ? ?I have noted how tender the boat  is when motoring with the tiller
>>> locked. ?The boat cannot maintain a  straight course if I am moving about 
>> the
>>> cabin. ?Of course, I am 230  pounds, and that's more ballast to adjust the
>>> course, but I have  learned to steer the boat by changing my position 
>> (even
>>> slightly) in  the cockpit. ?My good sailing friend has a McGregor 25 and 
>> he
>>> has more  "wetted surface" ?(to borrow a term from Stan). ?He can lock his
>>> tiller and wander fore and aft and beam to beam yet still maintain his  
>> basic
>>> course. He is more stable and takes more wind to heel the boat.  ?Our keel
>>> weights are about the same. ?In the event that flipped my  boat, his 
>> moored
>>> just a hundred feet away, didn't have a cushion out  of place. True, this
>>> could be due in part to the nature of the weather  event itself, but still
>>> telling as to the side to side stability  issue. ?BNy the way, the 
>> integrity
>>> of my mast has been compromised by  being buried in the bottom
>>>>> mud. Looks like a new mast is in  the picture. ?Ah well, you've got to
>>> have stories to call yourself a  sailor. ?Aye, mates??
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> ?  ??
>>>>> Joe Camp
>>>>> s/v John Dawson
>>>>> Bohemia River, MD
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>>> From: Mary Lou Troy  <mtroy at atlanticbb.net>
>>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List  <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> 
>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August  21, 2012 8:50 PM
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Advise  me
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I think any small relatively  unballasted boat would be more at risk 
>>>>>> on a mooring. Our  boats also have a fair amount of windage with the 
>>>>>> IMF and  the flared hull. In a strong wind the poptops are probably  
>>>>>> also a liability unless well secured. I've never felt  unsafe at 
>>>>>> anchor and we've been anchored in some pretty  high winds but they 
>>>>>> were of short duration and our  anchorages are typically more 
>>>>>> protected than most mooring  fields.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Somewhere I saw it noted that  with the warming climate, the world is 
>>>>>> a windier place.  That certainly seems true here on the Chesapeake 
>>>>>> (though  not today).
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Mary  Lou
>>>>>> 1991 R22 Fretless
>>>>>> Rock Hall,  MD
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> At 06:13 PM  8/21/2012, you wrote:
>>>>>>> Lack of a deep heavy keel is  definitely a contributing factor.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Stephen
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Aug 21, 2012, at 5:04 PM, Joe Camp  <jjcampjr at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> "Luck of the draw."? Yeah, odd that so many R-22s  flipp like 
>>>>>>> this.? It must be the global warming... er  ah, "climate change" 
>>>>>>> R-22 effect.? Was this in Al  Gore's movie?
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Joe
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>>>>>> From: Stephen  Staum <snstaum at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>> To: The Rhodes  22 Email List  <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>>>>>>>> Sent:  Tuesday, August 21, 2012 4:27 PM
>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re:  [Rhodes22-list] Advise me
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Mine also turtled on its mooring w local  cyclones reported. 1 
>>>>>>> power boat was wrecked on the  rocks - no other boats in the mooring 
>>>>>>> field were  damaged. I think it is just the luck of the  draw.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Stephen
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Sent  from my iPhone
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On Aug 21, 2012, at 3:31 PM, Joe Camp  <jjcampjr at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Chris:
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> I was not driven ashore.? She flipped  right at the 
>>>>>>> mooring.? All other moored boats very  near got nothing. I am 
>>>>>>> looking for a slip for next  season.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Joe
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> From:  Chris Geankoplis  <napoli68 at charter.net>
>>>>>>>>>>> To: 'The  Rhodes 22 Email List'  <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 12:19  PM
>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Advise  me
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> In my case it took a tornado going  thru the "pot" on Poplar 
>>>>>>> Island to do  the
>>>>>>>>>>> deed.? If you sail in shoal waters  it will happen to any boat 
>>>>>>> given  enough
>>>>>>>>>>> sudden wind.? In the last 35  years Joe is the only one I can 
>>>>>>> recall  other
>>>>>>>>>>> than mine, and he was driven  ashore, right?
>>>>>>>>>>> Chris  G
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original  Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>> From:  rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of  PBR
>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012  8:15 AM
>>>>>>>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email  List
>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list]  Advise me
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> I don't want to wish ill upon anyone  else but...with all this 
>> talk
>>>>>>>>>>> about  Rhodes 22's with Masts stuck in the mud, are our boats  
>> more
>>>>>>>>>>> inclined to suffer this fate or  did these recent storms cause a 
>> lot
>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>> havoc for other boats the same  size?
>>>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe/unsubscribe go to
>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/mailman/listinfo/rhodes22-list
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> For the list Charter and help with  using the mailing list and 
>>>>>>> archives go  to
>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe/unsubscribe go to 
>>>>>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/mailman/listinfo/rhodes22-list
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> For the list Charter and help with  using the mailing list and 
>>>>>>> archives go to  http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe/unsubscribe go to 
>>>>>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/mailman/listinfo/rhodes22-list
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> For the list Charter and help with using  the mailing list and 
>>>>>>> archives go to  http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> To subscribe/unsubscribe go to 
>>>>>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/mailman/listinfo/rhodes22-list
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> For the list Charter and help with using the  mailing list and 
>>>>>>> archives go to  http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>> To subscribe/unsubscribe go to 
>>>>>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/mailman/listinfo/rhodes22-list
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> For the list Charter and help with using the  mailing list and 
>>>>>>> archives go to  http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>> To  subscribe/unsubscribe go to 
>>>>>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/mailman/listinfo/rhodes22-list
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> For the list Charter and help with using the mailing  list and 
>>>>>>> archives go to  http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> -----
>>>>>>> No virus found in this  message.
>>>>>>> Checked by AVG -  www.avg.com
>>>>>>> Version: 2012.0.2197 / Virus Database:  2437/5214 - Release Date:
>>> 08/21/12
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>> To  subscribe/unsubscribe go to
>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/mailman/listinfo/rhodes22-list
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> For the list Charter and help with using the mailing list  and archives
>>> go to http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>> 
>>>>> Message:  2
>>>>> Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2012 09:09:00 -0700 (PDT)
>>>>> From: Joe Camp <jjcampjr at yahoo.com>
>>>>> Subject: Re:  [Rhodes22-list] Advise me
>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List  <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>> <1345651740.5488.YahooMailNeo at web130202.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>>>>> 
>>>>> Chris:
>>>>> 
>>>>> ? ? ?Yeah, thank the maker for  insurance. ?I learned yesterday that my
>>> mast has suffered some dimples  up where the spreaders attach. ?I sent 
>> pics
>>> to Stan, and he confirmed  that these will make the mast weaker, maybe 
>> even
>>> unsafe. ?So, I  suppose I am on the hard for the rest of the season. ?The
>>> marina crew  has the cabin cleaned out pretty well, so the main issue is 
>> the
>>> mast.  ?As I said to Mary Lou: "you've got to have stories to call 
>> yourself a
>>> sailor." ?ttfn.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Joe?
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>>> From: Chris Geankoplis  <napoli68 at charter.net>
>>>>>> To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email  List' <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> 
>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday,  August 22, 2012 1:16 AM
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list]  Advise me
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Gee  Joe,
>>>>>> ??? Sounds like Whack a Mole and you lost.? I'm glad  you have 
>> insurance,
>>>>>> let us know how things came out.?  Sounds like Peter was treated well 
>> by
>>> his
>>>>>> insurance.
>>>>>> Chris G
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From:  rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
>>>>>> [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Joe  Camp
>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 12:31  PM
>>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Advise me
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Chris:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I was not  driven ashore. ?She flipped right at the mooring. ?All  
>> other
>>>>>> moored boats very near got nothing. I am looking for  a slip for next
> 
> __________________________________________________
> To subscribe/unsubscribe go to http://www.rhodes22.org/mailman/listinfo/rhodes22-list
> 
> For the list Charter and help with using the mailing list and archives go to http://www.rhodes22.org/list
> __________________________________________________

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